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Frugal Horns

lordsummit

Moderator
I've been using my little AVI Neutrons for about ten years now. They're a lovely speaker, and I think they stand up really well. They sing on the end of my Quad 306, which is only fed by a Chord Mojo with a passive-pre in the middle. I think it's a very nice simple set-up, which does most of what I want.

Like most of us though, I can't help thinking about what-if... I've sorted the pre, the DAC and the power-amp in the last twelve months, and I'm thinking about changing the speakers. This is partly fuelled by missing out on buying back a pair of speakers I was very fond of, but didn't really work in my room, and partially because sometimes a change is as good as a rest.

Now here's the rub, the bloody room! It's square, has a staircase on one side, and a damn annoying room boom at about 45khz, small speakers that don't go too low don't trigger it, the AVIs and Klipsch Heresy have worked really well in there. I bought a sub once, and tweaked and tuned and tweaked and tuned, until one day I wondered what it was doing, so turned off the speakers. The answer was absolutely nothing. I guess really low bass is a low priority to me.

I listen to mostly jazz, classical (orchestral and chamber music), some rock, a bit of everything really.

I'd started saving for some Audionote AZ-2, I've heard them and really liked them. In the context of my room they'd work quite well, although they'd have to go near to the wall rather than in a corner. (I haven't got two useable corners...)

Tony L of this parish though suggested to me an interesting and leftfield option could be some Frugal Horns. I've never heard them, although have been interested in them, and have read lots about how good they are. They could be an interesting option. I can build them, although I'd probably get a kit, I have access to lots of wordworking equipment, so actually a from scratch build would be an option, but for ease I'd maybe get a kit.

My first question is has anybody in the vicinity of Manchester got a pair they wouldn't mind letting me hear or better still lending me a pair for a few days so I can give them a spin in my peculiarly dysfunctional room?

The second question is what is the difference between the Frugal Horns and the Frugal Horns XL? Also which drivers? Orangeart sells the kits, but there is a bewildering range of drivers. I'd almost certainly stick to the 306 to drive them with, so ease of driving isn't the main criteria.

I'm told that they manage the Lowther magic, without as many compromises. This is very interesting to me, as I value coherence, and really like the naturalness they present some music with. I'm not sure though that with all the different styles of music I listen to I'd like a pair of speakers that choose the music for me!
 
The difference (in basic terms):
Frugelhorn Lite - for 3" drivers
Frugelhorn (Mk3) - for 4-5" Drivers
Frugehorn XL - for 6" drivers
 
Thanks, but I think they're a bit small, the room is 5mx5m. Really kind though, thanks. I'm kind of veering towards the XL version.
 
ESLs, my friend

Fabulous speakers, but far beyond impossible in Richard’s space. The listening room is pretty much a cube that connects house together, i.e. it has doors to the kitchen, main living room and a staircase going up to the 1st floor. ESLs anywhere would block something critical. A key requirement is that the speaker is wall proximity or very, very close to that. I have a hunch Frugal Horns may work there pretty well as I think, like Heresys etc, they roll before the room node takes over. The little AVIs work very well to my ears, I like them, though a little more scale and ease would obviously be welcome. I’ve always really liked Frugal Horns on the few occasions I’ve heard them though obviously can’t predict how they’d play in Richard’s room.

PS The other main contenders to my mind are something in the Snell/Audio Note or vintage Acoustic Research mindset, i.e. a well-behaved wall-proximity box with a nice 8” paper bass unit that would have a little more heft than the little AVIs.
 
I dream of ESLs, but 'beyond impossible' is about the best description imaginable! The AVIs sit about a foot away from the wall on big solid stands. I wouldn't get permission at this point for big old speakers, so the choice is a little limited, and may include doing nothing. Looking at the sizes again of Frugal Horns, I think either the mark 3 or the XL should work. They're not huge things are they?

I'm just pondering if they need a corner. I don't have corners, one has the door into the porch, the a second is available, one has the staircase and one has a door into the kitchen. It's a great room, and will be even better when I can convert it back into mine all mine instead of a kid's playroom/study/listening room, but it's far from ideal.

I think it's a bit more scale I'm chasing, and that holographic sense that a solo instrument is really there, you know, the Mr Coltrane in the room sort of thing I'd like. Maybe I'm hankering after the impossible, but also maybe a bit of fun can be had. I could build the Frugal horns, sell the AVIs and stands, and not be too far in. That'd be good as far as Mrs L is concerned.
 
I love my XL Frugalhorns. They replaced far more expensive speakers and I have no plans to switch them out anytime soon. They also happened to sound superb here with a Quad 306 and a passive pre amp .. just saying ...

Phil hifinut borrowed a pair from James brumjam, who posts more often on Aos and, pre sell out, wigwam. Not sure if James ever sold his but he’s in Brum, and was happy to lend them.
 
I love my XL Frugalhorns. They replaced far more expensive speakers and I have no plans to switch them out anytime soon. They also happened to sound superb here with a Quad 306 and a passive pre amp .. just saying ...

Phil hifinut borrowed a pair from James brumjam, who posts more often on Aos and, pre sell out, wigwam. Not sure if James ever sold his but he’s in Brum, and was happy to lend them.

I'll have a look for him. Thanks
 
It is an awkward space. Pretty much square, I’d guess at about 14’ or so. The way things are oriented now the speakers are against the only wall that doesn’t have a door in it, though there is a staircase immediately to the left. The problem will always be positioning the speakers where they are not in the way of through-traffic (it is the main hub to the house) and are still wide enough apart to give a decent stereo image.

PS NS1000s may well work! I’d previously suggested far cheaper variants on the chunky sealed-box theme e.g. vintage ARs, Ditton 15, 33, 44 etc. I’m just not sure whether they’d boom as there is certainly a prominent node in that room, one the little AVIs don’t hit, but I’ve heard before with other speakers.
 
8" Tannoy DC's.....coherence and a rolled off bass?

Any specific models to look out for? A pair of LRM/LGM (12”, but small cab so very little bass!) would work great there I reckon, but they seem to be getting very expensive these days.
 
Any specific models to look out for? A pair of LRM/LGM (12”, but small cab so very little bass!) would work great there I reckon, but they seem to be getting very expensive these days.
Any of the DMT monitors 8/10/12. My only thought against the 8's is Richard is looking for a step up in scale and if you can't use a sub then a bigger cone may be needed. HPD Eatons may do it too.
 
Look no further. You may remember that I am the current custodian of the pfm loaner Frugalhorns. I'm in Leeds, they belong in Huddersfield. There was talk of a chap in Halifax giving them a run out, but that didn't happen. There was then talk of them finding lodgings in York, again that didn't happen. So, fancy a trip over?
 
@lordsummit

You are more than welcome to come to Warwick and borrow a pair of XL's and Lites for a couple of weeks if you would like?

They are great for thier ability to be tuned fairly easily to your room.

I can show you how the kits work while you are here so you can see how easy it is.

Stefan
 
Look no further. You may remember that I am the current custodian of the pfm loaner Frugalhorns. I'm in Leeds, they belong in Huddersfield. There was talk of a chap in Halifax giving them a run out, but that didn't happen. There was then talk of them finding lodgings in York, again that didn't happen. So, fancy a trip over?

@lordsummit

You are more than welcome to come to Warwick and borrow a pair of XL's and Lites for a couple of weeks if you would like?

They are great for thier ability to be tuned fairly easily to your room.

I can show you how the kits work while you are here so you can see how easy it is.

Stefan

Thank-you both! I’ll look at what’s coming up and get in touch. I’ll try and find a family free weekend, I think the 15th of September is possible. Could possibly get to Warwick on the Thursday, Leeds is but a small stretch away.

I’ll try to take a picture of the room, and ask for help posting it tomorrow, I’ve not figured out how to using Flickr, I think the app muddles issues. I’m heading to pfm central tomorrow night, so maybe Tony can show me!

Frank what sort of money would I be looking at, I’m a big fan of Tannoys, although the big fun with the little horns would be the chance to play with sandpaper and the like.
 
A totally off the wall way of solving your problem is to get a Linn ADS/M and use the Space optimisation software to tame the room....
 


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