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Speakers for classical music

I would second Eyebroughty's suggestion for Linn Isobariks, maybe not the most accurate speakers but if you want big scale sound for orchestra I think they sound awesome.
"Not the most accurate speakers" ....(Your quote)........ I cannot believe I read that. You just let the cat out of the bag. Excuse me, but classical listeners do not attempt to be 'footie tappers'. I always thought classical music reproduction is firstly about hard nosed accuracy. Not about speakers that attempt 'being awesome' and yet then still make a buggar of a job, even at that. Linn Isobariks are just plain crude.
 
Good point.

One word of caution I'd chuck in concerns babies and bathwater. Some years ago, I almost changed my beloved Rogers for a beautiful pair of Cura floorstanders, which were available to me ex-dem. They did deeper more textured bass than my Rogers and generally seemed to have a 'bigger' sound.
However, on a proper comparison, they completely lost it with something like Ashkenazy playing Mozart piano stuff. Couldn't keep up at all and were revealed as quite crude and unsubtle with classical.
Mull

Might be a reason to try out a powered sub ... if you really like your stand mount speakers, and just want to add some depth and scale (without replacing speakers or taxing your amp any further)
 
ter,

Are you kidding?:mad: A pair of Linn Isobariks.???!! I once went and listened repeated for long periods various Naim set up combination on classical and jazz.. A friend was interested in this type of equipment. Then he decided with Naim application: listened to Linn Isobarils playing amongst other things a fair stretch of Organ music........ Using a magnificent demonstration disc of the organist Piet Kee. I have to admit I can still remember the absolute sense of stress I felt listening to repeat sections of it., I wanted to literally put an axe through the Isobariks, especially an 8minutes 2 second track of Mendelssohn organ music , in particular. That's how vividly bad the reproduction 'was'. They are a lumbering lazy pig of a speaker.
I had the opposite experience with Isobariks. They're more coloured than a box of crayons, but Briks are one of the few speakers I've heard that can do the trouser flappers in organ music.

Joe
 
"Not the most accurate speakers" ....(Your quote)........ I cannot believe I read that. You just let the cat out of the bag. Excuse me, but classical listeners do not attempt to be 'footie tappers'. I always thought classical music reproduction is firstly about hard nosed accuracy. Not about speakers that attempt 'being awesome' and yet then still make a buggar of a job, even at that. Linn Isobariks are just plain crude.

LOL...somebody remind me to tell an old customer (a world-renowned violin maker) that The Great Swami Audiophile Known As Ter divined he should immediately stop voicing his creations based on analysis through briks as well as listening to classical music through them for work and pleasure.



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I differ on that point. Rock music likes various humps in its frequency range to give the best impression. Classical............flat response all the way. Like comparing a Quad Electrostatic with a set of JBL's head bangers.

That probably arises from the compromises in the playback chain for rock vs classical.
 
Holy shit a violin maker uses replayed music as his reference to tuning his instruments, how utterly 100% shit must his violins sound.
 
LOL...somebody remind me to tell an old customer (a world-renowned violin maker) that The Great Swami Audiophile Known As Ter divined he should immediately stop voicing his creations based on analysis through briks as well as listening to classical music through them for work and pleasure.



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I stand by my opinion. My classical music listening is about 98% to 2% pop. and over long periods every day. I am certainly familiar with the quirks and presentation of various speaker designs dating back to the earliest days of stereo.

(1) The subject was originally 'about bass'. The last time I can remember: I do not think any person had ever claimed violins - produced bass. Though I have found it ridiculously funny when I have seen people reproducing solo violin with a couple of oven- sized mono -block amps with fans. One immediately thought "Oh! the big earnest endeavor behind all that effort, to reproduce perhaps one sound watt":D

(2) It has been known for 'yonks' that some musicians can appreciate music through less than ideal speakers. They tend to automatically compensate for sound reproduction shortcomings.

(3) The greatest disappointment with Briks........so much , one can assume - went into the design... they were an expensive model, they are large and have plenty of physical weight in the cabinet. They require very sizable amplification, and yet 'they blew it'- as far as the final result goes..

(4) Where is the 'contrapuntal dancing spring and agility' in its reproduction? That is, a fully balanced relationship between its bottom, middle and top ...to give listeners ...a sense of 'instant delighted surprise' every time they are turned on. That is what a buyer pays for ,and has a right to demand in that price league. To stop confusion -I am not talking in terms, about modern music 'simple footie tapping'.

(5) Discernible coloration in a classical speaker.... a potential buyer might as
well go to their 'High St' and buy something on offer- saving a heck of a lot of money.

(6) It is far better to buy a clean bookshelf speaker that misses the last bottom octave or so, than put up with muddy dirge-like barking bass thrown in, on top of the rest of the sound spectrum. By some large speaker that falls short of its low bass aims to 'hover and purr a firm bass foundation' rather than giving the impression it is like: ' a sluggish heavy flow of half -melted chocolate' Otherwise, it becomes a total lose-lose situation, all round.

(7)An option: Buy a good sub woofer to tack onto a clean bookshelf. It is a lot lot cheaper proposition. At least, if the bass ever got a little muddy at times on some classical material... it would be easier to solve the problem - by just tuning it down or turning off the added sub.
 
I can definitely recommend large Tannoys for classical stuff. I'm running Monitor Gold 15" in homemade GRF cabs and they came in at around £1500 (plus a fair bit of graft on my part for the cabs). You could probably find a reasonable pair of Lancasters with Gold 15"s for a bit less than £1500 if you look around. HPDs would be a bit less money and almost as good IMHO.

I've found scale to be excellent, but also instrument timbre is very good. Violins sound like violins etc
 
Holy shit a violin maker uses replayed music as his reference to tuning his instruments, how utterly 100% shit must his violins sound.
Love it! Probably for making those ' beginner's violin models ' for school kids trying out, if they would like learning 'Twinkle Twinkle Little Star' on the violin,.;)
 
I can definitely recommend large Tannoys for classical stuff. I'm running Monitor Gold 15" in homemade GRF cabs and they came in at around £1500 (plus a fair bit of graft on my part for the cabs). You could probably find a reasonable pair of Lancasters with Gold 15"s for a bit less than £1500 if you look around. HPDs would be a bit less money and almost as good IMHO.

I've found scale to be excellent, but also instrument timbre is very good. Violins sound like violins etc
NOW.....we are talking about Tannoys. Speakers, that can actually do justice to classical music. I would not turn my nose up at a pair of Tannoys.
 
Classic BBC monitors :Spendor BC1,SP1,SP1/2. The larger S100/SP100 rare to find.
Beautifully balanced speakers with excellent instrument timbre.
I prefer them to Harbeths.
 
Good point.

One word of caution I'd chuck in concerns babies and bathwater. Some years ago, I almost changed my beloved Rogers for a beautiful pair of Cura floorstanders, which were available to me ex-dem. They did deeper more textured bass than my Rogers and generally seemed to have a 'bigger' sound.
However, on a proper comparison, they completely lost it with something like Ashkenazy playing Mozart piano stuff. Couldn't keep up at all and were revealed as quite crude and unsubtle with classical.

When I worked for Audio Ex, we sold Shahinians. It was intriguing how many people paired them with NAIM kit.

I too found their version of sound staging somewhat difficult to accept.

Also, whether you actually like it or not, play a bit of Brass Band music through any prospective speaker purchase. If they can do that, they can do anything from the P.O.V. of reproducing tone and instrumental 'power'. Still need to check out the ability to remain un-flustered on things like piano though..

Mull

Which Rogers are they?
 
"Not the most accurate speakers" ....(Your quote)........ I cannot believe I read that. You just let the cat out of the bag. Excuse me, but classical listeners do not attempt to be 'footie tappers'. I always thought classical music reproduction is firstly about hard nosed accuracy. Not about speakers that attempt 'being awesome' and yet then still make a buggar of a job, even at that. Linn Isobariks are just plain crude.

I wouldn't go as far as the opprobrium above, having enjoyed their 'wall of sound' aspect and phenominally deep, crisp bass for many years in the eighties/early nineties.

I didn't play much classical on them, though, for the simple reason that the tweeters were far too edge of seat for violins, at least.

Okay, they were powered by Naim (250, then 135s), but Briks are NOT a speaker for classical music. 'Orses for courses !
 
yes bariks are coloured, as are most speakers.

I have yet to hear a speaker that isnt.


and the likes of spendor bc1 is to my ears MORE coloured than a pair of isobariks ever were.

that classical music requires somehow different speakers than other types is absolute tosh.

If anything the reduced workload required by most classical music makes speaker selection less critical.

A good system should be able to play all types of music, I have heard some systems that are supposedly 'tuned for classical' and playing jazz or folk music fall very flat.

When evaluating systems in front of a customer and having little positive to say we used to rely on the classic.

'It sounds very clear'

or when there was really nothing of merit

'I'll bet it sounds great with classical.'
 
I am drawing on my knowledge, experience and training over the years to provide a high-level summary.

If you are interested what you could do is google on 'hearing aids for musicians' as the hearing aid people have done loads of research to help musicians who have damaged hearing through playing in orchestras.

I damage mine playing in a loud band.

Cheers,

DV

Yes, but the musicians are by definition in the middle of the orchestra, and what you're trying to approximate with Hifi is the experience of someone listening say 1/3 of the way up the concert hall. The listeners in the good seats of the auditorium are at least 10-20m away. I go to a fair amount of classical concerts and always make sure I'm well away from anything like 110 dB. 100 dB is bad enough. <another reason I don't play in a brass band>
 
yes bariks are coloured, as are most speakers.

I have yet to hear a speaker that isnt.


and the likes of spendor bc1 is to my ears MORE coloured than a pair of isobariks ever were.

that classical music requires somehow different speakers than other types is absolute tosh.

If anything the reduced workload required by most classical music makes speaker selection less critical.

A good system should be able to play all types of music, I have heard some systems that are supposedly 'tuned for classical' and playing jazz or folk music fall very flat.

When evaluating systems in front of a customer and having little positive to say we used to rely on the classic.

'It sounds very clear'

or when there was really nothing of merit

'I'll bet it sounds great with classical.'
What a cop out! Most rock and pop speakers absolutely rely on humps and spikes for their 'exciting' characteristics. We used to know that..referring to it with the dirty term as 'presence' speakers. I;R Linn Kans anyone? Also I have heard big Klipschorns in a rather large auditorium 'die wallowing' all over the place and sounding totally foreign - reproducing a Beethoven Piano Sonata. Yet within a flash - when changed over to a rather small speaker system far too small for that same space - and many, many times cheaper(at least 10 times cheaper) - it excelled with noted balance and sparkle, giving a very good impression indeed of what a grand piano actually sounds like.
People forget: unlike rock, and other micro phoned forms of music, classical lovers are accustomed to hearing live classical music totally - electrically un- amplified'. Each instrument performing in its natural state showing its capacities and limits - judged and balanced alongside the various capacities of other instruments, in play. Less than flat frequency response in a speaker playing classical music - when knowing the actual score - can quickly show up with particular instrument predominance and strange textural characteristics -that should not be there. So sensing that: by trying a few more examples from other known recordings , if it persists.....the speaker is not a 'classical speaker' . For not reproducing 'in proportion' exactly what could be reasonably expected in real life live performance. If one feels 'it does not happen in real live performance THAT WAY': the speaker should be disregarded. Neutrality also, does not have to equate - to 'sonic flatness' AKA dullness.
As well a classical speaker should be able to give a even full panorama presentation of any instrument or voice as one would find possible, in a concert hall or opera house.

How many pop fans analyze the sheer texture of any particular rock instrument being reproduced? They assume what they hear, is what the performer did..most likely - twiddling up or down on the knob of their electric guitar, with whatever form of amplifier brand, they also were using 'on the day'. Electronics - recording other electronic produced sounds!
 


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