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Labour Leader: Keir Starmer VII

At the moment, I hope most would take a slim chance over no chance.
So far Starmer has promised a Green New Deal, more police, more nurses, a Great British energy company and it is promising to cut government spending.

Something will have to give, the only question is what?
 
I don't care how cynical their use of green policies is or not, *if* it results in those policies being enacted when they come into power.
Sure, but it's a pretty big if. A lot of the "green crap" is going to be difficult to implement *meaningfully*: it will use up political capital and damage careers. So it's good to have it confirmed that they're not committed to it, that they see it as a silly hoop they have to jump through to please an electorate they despise, and that they are likely tor restrict themselves to fudges and gestures if they can. Just so we all know where we stand: these people will have to be forced to do anything worthwhile.
 
Unusual level of honesty from a "senior Labour figure" here:

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Tittle-tattle really, but it gives you an idea of the bottomless cynicism of these people.
They are politicians.

Are you going to tell us that the popes Catholic next? ;)
 
So far Starmer has promised a Green New Deal, more police, more nurses, a Great British energy company and it is promising to cut government spending.

Something will have to give, the only question is what?
By reversing the recent change in the top rate of tax.
 
Personally I'm hoping it's the bungs to mates and backers that will be cut.
You will be disappointed:

https://twitter.com/ByRobDavies/status/1575030935115862017

There's a revolving door between the PLP and the gambling industry.

Just one example. There are many more.

Starmer's Labour Party is predicated on attracting donations from the very wealthy and large corporations. Do you think they will do that out of the goodness of their hearts?
 
Oh, OK, maybe so. Happy to withdraw my accusation that the Labour Party is full of cynical, manipulative shits, in that case. ;)
The commitment to environmental policies stands, but the article does give the impression that if the electoral numbers didn't support it, it would be dropped. It's all about a simultaneous appeal to the Red Wall up north and the middle-class seats down south, never mind the fact that the actual planet is becoming unliveable.
Yet party insiders say they have reason for optimism. With the divisions of Brexit largely behind them and with Boris Johnson now yesterday’s man, working-class voters in so-called Red Wall areas feel “gettable” again, said one person working on the party’s campaign team. A mass drive for decarbonisation is seen as a crucial link between these working-class and middle-class groups, potentially creating new jobs while answering concerns about climate change.
 
As ever, nothing but a hard left govt will do for a few, forever stating as fact what Labour will do and what Labour will not do depending on which one fits their fundamentalist agenda. You would think such knowledgeable folk about Labour would have a suggestion of who could form a left wing party to challenge the tories.

So far Starmer has promised a Green New Deal, more police, more nurses, a Great British energy company and it is promising to cut government spending.

Something will have to give, the only question is what?
Whatever it is it won’t be enough.
 
The commitment to environmental policies stands, but the article does give the impression that if the electoral numbers didn't support it, it would be dropped. It's all about a simultaneous appeal to the Red Wall up north and the middle-class seats down south, never mind the fact that the actual planet is becoming unliveable.

It's an unfortunate inconvenience that in order to make any positive changes to society one must first get elected.
 
It's an unfortunate inconvenience that in order to make any positive changes to society one must first get elected.
Oh, sure. But not doing something about climate change is as dumb as not having a defence policy, and neither of the two main parties is talking in those terms.
 
The left, of course, don’t want to get elected.

Why persist with this straw man argument?

Because my takeaway from this thread is that it's more important to many on the left to
- maintain ideological purity
- deride (demonstrate one's moral superiority to) the bourgeoisie / centrist dad etc
- demonstrate how much they understand the plight of the "common man"
- propose that nothing will change until the economic system (ism) is completely changed (but no realistic mechanism for radical change is proposed)

than it is to get on with the messy but necessary business of compromise, coalition building, and finding common goals that will enable a center left party to be elected and make some positive changes in society.
 
Because my takeaway from this thread is that it's more important to many on the left to
- maintain ideological purity
- deride (demonstrate one's moral superiority to) the bourgeoisie / centrist dad etc
- demonstrate how much they understand the plight of the "common man"
- propose that nothing will change until the economic system (ism) is completely changed (but no realistic mechanism for radical change is proposed)

than it is to get on with the messy but necessary business of compromise, coalition building, and finding common goals that will enable a center left party to be elected and make some positive changes in society.
I can only conclude that that would be your takeaway from literally any encounter with left wing criticism of a centrist party, because it’s not really based on anything that’s actually been said.

To be clear, my position is that the best we can hope for is that the Labour Party replace the Conservatives and that pressure is brought to bear on them to make good on their progressive promises. For that to happen it needs to be widely understood that they straight up do not want to make good on their progressive promises. You might well disagree with that sentiment but we never really to the point that it can be discussed, because someone always presses the Lesser Evil button, or the Left Wing Puritan button or whatever.
 
Because my takeaway from this thread is that it's more important to many on the left to
- maintain ideological purity
- deride (demonstrate one's moral superiority to) the bourgeoisie / centrist dad etc
- demonstrate how much they understand the plight of the "common man"
- propose that nothing will change until the economic system (ism) is completely changed (but no realistic mechanism for radical change is proposed)

than it is to get on with the messy but necessary business of compromise, coalition building, and finding common goals that will enable a center left party to be elected and make some positive changes in society.

+ the privileged comrades are too selfish to vote for Starmer/Labour.
 


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