Cyclists to be awarded equality with motorists.

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

<snip>

Moral 1. If you understand the above and still don't take care to avoid the big, hard, fast things, you are not quite all there IMO.
Moral 2. All the above categories contain their share of idiots/maniacs/stupid people/poorly sighted people/very old people/ learners/criminals and etc etc. Double Jeopardy. Be aware of the unaware.

All that said, whoever you are and however you are getting about, if you harm someone or something else, you should be brought to justice.

I guess what's being said here is that everybody has responsibility for their own, and others' safety while using the road, and anybody who doesn't is a twat. So don't be that twat.

And that, sometimes, justice requires that somebody who caused a bad thing didn't actually do bad stuff, they were just human and fallible so they don't deserve punishment.

 

[awkwardbydesign]

That's interesting.
I live on the outskirts of Leeds & we get many car drivers flying through our town & the surrounding towns.
They approach without caution & will even drive around you at high speed when using the zebra crossing.
They are extremely dangerous.
Many of them are not from our towns but turn up from all over the country in their cars which they drive with gay abandon.
They also litter the area with their disposable drinks, food wrappers etc.

Twats. All of them.

I am a motorcyclist, and most of that applies to some. Except the littering bit, as it is hard to do that when riding a motorbike. I stick to the speed limits and keep my revs down, but many don't.

 

[Andrew C!]

While slagging off the pure evil that is the cyclist, remember, car drivers…

Rufford water splash has claimed many who thought they’d get away with it.

I’ve driven through rufford mill ford without incident, no one posted a video though.

lol

vehicle means motor vehicle,

Pedal cycles do feature in the RTA for specific circumstances. I’ve prosecuted accordingly when those circumstances have been met, including careless cycling, and also riding whilst unfit thru drink/drugs.

There's no defined term 'vehicle' in the act, but there's 'motor vehicle' which does imply that you can have another form of vehicle which isn't motorised. Also, look at the wording in the section - it refers to 'driving or propelling a vehicle'

Agreed. A bit of common sense and objective interpretation of available offences usually points in the right direction. Actually there is attendant legislation that asks prosecuting agencies to ensure that happens.

Speeding cyclists can be pretty similar to speeding vehicle drivers in my book, as a general rule. I’ll go get my coat…

 

[Woodface]

regardless of due process and sentencing - is it fair that that cyclist who kills another road user can get a max custodial sentence that is way less than that could be inflicted on a car driver?

Surely that is putting the max punishment for the same offence (killing someone on the road/pavement) on a par with each other? Maybe we should reduce the max sentence for a driver down to that of a cyclist (or other road user) now that would be fair as well.

I don’t have a problem with that in theory but the current situation is that car drivers are generally treated very leniently, it just become ‘one of those things’. My fear is that cyclists will end up being treated more harshly due to the novelty factor, they will certainly get more negative media coverage.

If you look at sentencing for drivers it is very low compared to what it should be; o think we both agree on that. How about we properly enforce the laws we have?

 

[Woodface]

In the same way that a red traffic light means stop and applies to all users but almost all cyclists ignore them and never get any penalty. Feel free to justify your selective reasoning.

I have also lost count of the times I have been waiting at a junction for a cyclist who has the right of way, only to see them just turn off with no signals or regard for any other road user.

Almost all cyclists run red lights, where is your evidence? It’s just confirmation bias.

So because you stop at a give way it ok for another driver to assume otherwise? I don’t get your logic? A few seconds delay worth seriously injuring someone?

I always pull into the middle of the lane when approaching a junction as I expect the car to overshoot the line. I reckon about 50% do

 

[gintonic]

How about we properly enforce the laws we have?

yes all should be treated with parity. If car drivers are treated leniently then cyclists should.

This isn't a negotiation - if you read what I wrote carefully, you'll see I said this isn't about process and implementation.

 

[Brian]

Had my chariot in for an AC re-gas ( another story there, it's knacked ) and on going for a walk to fill time a cyclist went through a red on a busy roundabout as I was crossing on a green man light. I had to stop in the road, the temptation was strong...

They don't all do it but many do. The denial here of this behaviour from a significant number of entitled morons is laughable.

He wasn't in lycra, so no use of 'lycra clad', which will help at one sensitive soul.

 

[Paul L]

Crikey what a toxic thread in parts. Alas I’m an Audi driver (not the way it is stereotypically described) and a cyclist (not the way it is stereotypically described) but if the prejudices here are broadly held across the population I’m stuffed whichever activity I’m trying to do responsibly.

 

[Brian]

Almost all cyclists run red lights, where is your evidence? It’s just confirmation bias.

So because you stop at a give way it ok for another driver to assume otherwise? I don’t get your logic? A few seconds delay worth seriously injuring someone?

I always pull into the middle of the lane when approaching a junction as I expect the car to overshoot the line. I reckon about 50% do

Evidence? It looks like confirmation bias.

 

[Brian]

Crikey what a toxic thread in parts. Alas I’m an Audi driver (not the way it is stereotypically described) and a cyclist (not the way it is stereotypically described) but if the prejudices here are broadly held across the population I’m stuffed whichever activity I’m trying to do responsibly.

The trouble here is some of the 'lycra-clad' cyclists think they are a special case. I guess they might be in a certain way...

The majority are sensible and just want people treated the same if driving a car/riding a bike in a dangerous fashion.

 

[Tony L]

One thing that genuinely scares me around here is the number of clearly stoned drivers. So often a car will pull up at the lights accompanied by a huge skunk stench. I’ve never liked dope, just not a drug I’ve ever got along with (plus I’ve seen it destroy friends), but I know enough about it to know how it screws up perspective and reaction times at least as much as drinking a hefty dose of alcohol. It doesn’t make the person as aggressive, but I’d say at least as likely to make a mistake and kill someone. No idea how the police deal with it.

 

[martin clark]

I guess what's being said here is that everybody has responsibility for their own, and others' safety while using the road, and anybody who doesn't is a twat. So don't be that twat.

And that, sometimes, justice requires that somebody who caused a bad thing didn't actually do bad stuff, they were just human and fallible so they don't deserve punishment.

- That's a very concise summary I like.

And +1 @Tony L 's point re: stoned drivers. I often near-daily- drive & /or cycle in Bristol: and every time I do, at some point I'll experience the stench of such from some adjacent car or van, in even light traffic. It is everywhere, at all times of day.

 

[Brian]

Clearly a gap in my education/way I live as I have no idea what this stink is like.

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

It’s a consequence of leaving road policing to cameras - speed and ANPR. The messaging is: ‘don’t speed, or fail to have tax or insurance and you’ll be ok’. Cameras can’t detect drugs or drunks.

 

[Arkless Electronics]

True story of a bizarre incident that happened to someone I knew (haven't seen for many years).

He was walking in the Lake District late at night with his GF and a few mates on way back from pub in the middle of nowhere and getting close to the bottom of a steep hill on an unlit single track road when he heard a faint noise like the wind getting up.... but it was completely still.... he turns around to face the direction he thought the noise was coming from, and, as it was a single track in the boondocks at about 1AM and no noise of approaching car engine he stood in the middle of the road... (you can see where this is going). A couple of cyclists with no lights on were freewheeling down the steep hill and doing maybe 20 - 30 MPH when one of them ran head on into my mate! The cyclists helmet headbutted my mate and he ended up hospitalised with broken jaw, missing teeth, broken nose, broken ribs plus many cuts and bruises! Cyclist also taken to hospital with various cuts and bruises but nowhere near as bad.

 

[S-Man]

I’ve lost count of the times some prick (almost always in an Audi or BMW) overtakes me only to immediately slam on the brakes and turn left causing me to emergency brake or swerve. Are you defending these drivers in your stereotyping of all cyclists?

I get a similar issue very freqently...
Near my house there is a moderately steep hill about 200 yards long with a left turn at the bottom of the hill. It's a 30 limit, changing to 40 about 100 yards after the turning.
I cycle down the hill at about 25 to 30 MPH and stick my arm out very early to show that I will be getting out of their way very soon. Approx 30% of drivers will still overtake (dangerously!) at 40+, often with cars coming the other way.
It makes me so angry that they risk my safety to save 1 or 2 seconds .

Why do people spend huge sums of money on a car and are then so desperate to get out of the ficking things ASAP?

 

[farfromthesun]

the temptation was strong...

The temptation to do what was strong?

 

[Roog]

And some are not.

I suppose they could all drive a motor vehicle instead, now that would be a huge help on every level.

I once had a difficult discussion with a group of staff at work, apparently the new secure cycle storage bay took up space which could have been made into a car parking bay, obviously it would have been preferable for all of the cyclists to drive to work in their separate cars. Duh!

 

[Woodface]

yes all should be treated with parity. If car drivers are treated leniently then cyclists should.

This isn't a negotiation - if you read what I wrote carefully, you'll see I said this isn't about process and implementation.

Fair enough.

 

[Brian]

The temptation to do what was strong?

Well, it was tempting to keep going and be knocked over by a lunatic on a bike by not stopping in the middle of the road, of course. Obviously, the chance of a free cruise and a new car was possible as long as I survived the assault from the law breaker jumping the red light, but I decided certainty of life in one piece was preferable, so I stopped despite the temptation. I did fear the law breaker wouldn’t be insured and other law breaking types who jump red lights would blame me for daring to cross the road on a green man with a cyclist approaching a red light.

HTH