Roe V Wade overturned?
- Thread starter Tony L
- Start date
PsB
Citizen of Nowhere™
Or disingenuous. She’s been in politics long enough to know how these things work.
Tony L
Administrator
Just to shine a little further light on what this particular can of worms contains here is the Wikipedia list of “Pro Life” terrorist events in the USA. A disturbingly lengthy catalogue of murders, attempted murders, assaults, kidnappings, bombings, arson, vandalism and anthrax attacks.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Pro-life, pro-death. The Elect get to choose.
Mike & Van
Banned troll
I know next to nothing of the US political system, so I am confused as to why this is happening under a democratic govt. Surely this is a matter for elected representatives? Though I seriously doubt America will allow abortion to once again become illegal, wasn't it Trump who stuffed the supreme court with Right wingers, can't Biden unstuff it!
Hook
Blackbeard's former bo'sun.
Correct. The Supreme Court has an ultra-conservative majority thanks to T***p. What is changing as a result are state laws where the GOP hold majorities.
There are only two ways to get more liberal justices on the Supreme Court: death or expansion. Obviously, Dems can not control when someone dies, and expanding the court would require two senators - Manchin and Sinema - to vote for an exception to the filibuster. Neither said they will do so, so expansion will not happen.
Calls for Biden to be “stronger”, to somehow just make things happen, are unfortunately coming from people who do not understand how the US government works. Yes, he can issue executive orders, but there are limitations and he can always be challenged in court. That same Supreme Court, that one in the process of overturning 50 years of settled case law on abortion rights, has final say over whether or not a Biden executive order is constitutional.
sean99
pfm Member
What makes the situation utterly sickening is that:
"I’m not sure whether the legalization of abortion increased the total number of annual abortions that occurred in the United States, but it certainly substantially increased (by a factor of two) the ones that epidemiologists know about during the 1970s and 1980s. Despite this, there was an approximate 90% decrease in maternal deaths stemming from abortion—and that decrease is even greater the further back in time you go to use as the “baseline” for comparison. As has been said before, ending legal abortions does not stop them from occurring; it just stops them from occurring in safe medical settings."
- The GOP ceases to care about childhood wellbeing from the moment the child is born - routinely voting to deny health insurance to children.
- If abortion is once again illegal in much of the US many women will die.
"I’m not sure whether the legalization of abortion increased the total number of annual abortions that occurred in the United States, but it certainly substantially increased (by a factor of two) the ones that epidemiologists know about during the 1970s and 1980s. Despite this, there was an approximate 90% decrease in maternal deaths stemming from abortion—and that decrease is even greater the further back in time you go to use as the “baseline” for comparison. As has been said before, ending legal abortions does not stop them from occurring; it just stops them from occurring in safe medical settings."
SteveS1
I heard that, pardon?
Amazing how concerned these hypocrites are with the unborn. Of course as soon as the child is born Carlin is dead right they will vote against universal health care, paid parental leave, child benefit, free school meals, decent medical care for the children. While paying for their mistresses to have terminations abroad.
These measures will not stop abortions, they will make sure they happen in dangerous situations for mother and child. So much for the concern. I'm rather hoping this has given the Democrats something to properly get their vote out. This minority rule has got to be broken.
These measures will not stop abortions, they will make sure they happen in dangerous situations for mother and child. So much for the concern. I'm rather hoping this has given the Democrats something to properly get their vote out. This minority rule has got to be broken.
gavreid
Pretty Words...
All politics works in the same way - you can be an observer of events powerless and lacking influence, or you can lead and shape. The latter means having a set of policies that you argue for, you build the party, knock on doors, organise and support those fighting injustices such as this. Unfortunately the Democrats, and Biden especially, are in the pockets of the wealthy and most of them haven't done any of that for decades (there are exceptions that prove the rule), in fact many are the wealthy! Biden established a commission just so that he could duck the issue of the supreme court. The right have been organising for this for decades, while the liberals have been complacent - it's why I left the US in the 90s.
Tony L
Administrator
“Alito’s Leaked Draft Fully Overruling Roe Is Jaw-Dropping and Unprecedented” (Slate).
It looks pretty clear that the extremist Christian fundamentalist far-right that is now rooted in the Supreme Court thanks to Trump are only looking to start with abortion, and then continue their hatred, persecution and violence towards the LGBT+ communities and others. A good breakdown of the Alito draft here on Twitter. It is truly terrifying stuff.
It looks pretty clear that the extremist Christian fundamentalist far-right that is now rooted in the Supreme Court thanks to Trump are only looking to start with abortion, and then continue their hatred, persecution and violence towards the LGBT+ communities and others. A good breakdown of the Alito draft here on Twitter. It is truly terrifying stuff.
gavreid
Pretty Words...
He's completely away with the fairies - he states that supporters of abortion are eugenicists who are “motivated by a desire to suppress the size of the African American population”
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
The arguments that rights not enshrined in the constitution are somehow not valid rights (unless they say they are) is disturbing. Firstly, the constitution was written in different times; but also this is the second example I can think of (the first being the gun lobby) where the constitution is deployed in a way which actively harms the population.
We have calls over here for a written constitution. The US version is cited as probably the best one yet devised, but its flaws are showing. To those calling for one here, are you sure we could, or would, do a better job that could withstand assault over time?
We have calls over here for a written constitution. The US version is cited as probably the best one yet devised, but its flaws are showing. To those calling for one here, are you sure we could, or would, do a better job that could withstand assault over time?
Tony L
Administrator
The combination of Brexit and an unhinged alt-right Conservative Party has proven beyond doubt the structures we have in place are not sufficiently robust. We have lost a huge number of rights, freedoms and accountability mechanisms in the past few years and the government has made it increasingly clear their laws apply only to us, not to them. This, and the fact we are a monarchy, the least democratic thing imaginable, plus there are links between church and state, is our starting point.
I certainly support the idea of a constitution and Bill Of Rights. I’d want to see it based on broad concepts of ever-increasing human rights, civil liberties, political and legal accountability etc. As such more of a fluid ethos of equality, tolerance, support and political/legal scrutiny that could be updated to improve things, but never reversed into authoritarianism. It would obviously have an absolute split between state and religion, and the monarchy would be long gone outside a cosplay theme park context. Aligning fully with EU/international human rights legislation would be a good first step.
droodzilla
pfm Member
I haven't read the whole thing but this headline from The Times is interesting:
https://twitter.com/flying_rodent/status/1521739681402081281
My partner's been saying for a while that the right will import these issues from the US as yet another weapon in their culture wars.
I've always been sceptical about this because there are relatively few fundamentalist Christians in the UK. However, looking at the polling on abortion, a significant minority (around 20%) opposes it in all circumstances and I suspect that some of the support for abortion is quite soft. That's probably enough for a well-organised and funded campaign by the right to work with.
https://twitter.com/flying_rodent/status/1521739681402081281
My partner's been saying for a while that the right will import these issues from the US as yet another weapon in their culture wars.
I've always been sceptical about this because there are relatively few fundamentalist Christians in the UK. However, looking at the polling on abortion, a significant minority (around 20%) opposes it in all circumstances and I suspect that some of the support for abortion is quite soft. That's probably enough for a well-organised and funded campaign by the right to work with.
