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Brexit: give me a positive effect... XII

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Oh, do try to keep up, PsB.
I do try, honest... But some of this stuff is so bizarre that I sometimes struggle.
When I responded to you that 'he didn't', I meant that he didn't say it. I said it.
I got that, but why the fixation on sausages (or to stretch things, minced meat), rather than, say, pork chops, brussel sprouts or butter? You're not alone in your laser-like focus on this commodity: the whole tabloid press is barking up the same tree. Did someone send out a circular?
I know that you like everything to be entirely literal, and that the grey areas between the actual, written down lines of agreements don't exist, but the further 'grace periods' that the UK is threatening to extend in order to prevent the supermarkets from running out of goods include those relating to chilled meats. As I understand it, 'chilled meats' (which includes minced meat products, which in turn include sausages) cannot be sent into the EU customs area/SM either at all or without extensive, expensive and time-consuming SPS checks, which means that the logistics chains between the UK supermarkets distribution hubs and their NI branches are broken. The EU, as represented by Sefcovic, has said that any further unilateral extension of 'grace periods' by the UK will bring 'swift, firm and resolute' retaliation by the EU, and other EU sources have suggested that this retaliation 'might' include the suspension of (an unspecified 'some') tariff-free exports from the UK to the EU, and/or the imposition of quotas.
I know what Sefcovic said: essentially no more illegal, unilateral extensions. This covers everything, food, non-food. The lot. What I don't get is why a sophisticated, first-world economy like the UK can't sort out some phyto-sanitary checks given a bit of advance notice, say 6 months to a year, in order to honour a treaty commitment.
It therefore follows that if the UK continues to allow sausages to be sent into NI supermarkets, the EU will retaliate by attempting to disrupt or destroy UK exports of some or all goods (unspecified) to the EU by introducing quotas and tariffs. This could correspond to an attempt at some potentially pretty 'crushing' retaliation, in my view.
Again, why the laser focus on sausages? I don't think Sefcovic cares about sausages. He just doesn't want another unilateral extension. I get that the UK wants to use something, anything to try and plausibly renege on its freshly signed "deal". But why think sausages are the hill to die on?
 
I do try, honest... But some of this stuff is so bizarre that I sometimes struggle.

I got that, but why the fixation on sausages (or to stretch things, minced meat), rather than, say, pork chops, brussel sprouts or butter? You're not alone in your laser-like focus on this commodity: the whole tabloid press is barking up the same tree. Did someone send out a circular?

I know what Sefcovic said: essentially no more illegal, unilateral extensions. This covers everything, food, non-food. The lot. What I don't get is why a sophisticated, first-world economy like the UK can't sort out some phyto-sanitary checks given a bit of advance notice, say 6 months to a year, in order to honour a treaty commitment.

Again, why the laser focus on sausages? I don't think Sefcovic cares about sausages. He just doesn't want another unilateral extension. I get that the UK wants to use something, anything to try and plausibly renege on its freshly signed "deal". But why think sausages are the hill to die on?


But we are pragmatic. Why should we, with a trustworthy negotiator like Johnson's man have to stick to treaty agreements we signed to please a domestic audience with no intention of honouring? We're special. ET will bleat when you rightly point out that this is just another example of UK entitled exceptionalism, but that's exactly what it is. With roles reversed, the tabloids would be in a lather about how you can't trust these foreigners.
 
….
The threat to the GFA comes directly from the NI Protocol to the WA, and more specifically from the EU's overly and unnecessarily legalistic application of the Protocol.

I don’t think you can get away with a Del Boy approach to international trade which is what you are suggesting. Since leave are fond of three word slogans how about more.

“Deliver the promises!”

rather than

“Give them excuses!”
 
So another poorly negotiated and agreed deal with the EU and now we blame the EU for us agreeing with it. Seems like we agreed a lot of things just to get Brexit and worry about the consequences latter, maybe when COVID has passed us by.
 
Rude and aggressive posts? Coming from a hard remainer like you that’s a bit rich. You and others are doing that every day.

Steve, I do not support tory policies. It’s not a ‘claim’, as you attempt again to insinuate. You’re really scraping the barrel with that one. It’s an example of your own misrepresentation and rudeness.

Who is it I side with? Unlike some, I take every post at face value, I don’t like or dislike a post because of who wrote it, or who it’s slagging off. Someone who supports the tories but makes a post I agree with doesn’t mean I support tory policies.

My apparent ‘laying into people” for enabling the tories. I don’t lay into anyone. What I’ve pointed out is no tory govt = no brexit. Sorry if you disagree but that’s my view, brexit started way before 2016. In any case, your sensitivity over my supposed laying into people pales into insignificance when compared to you and other hard remainers. There has been very little civil from quite a few members since that 2016 referendum, in fact, it started during the campaigning and I’m not alone in thinking that.

So many words, so little substance.
 
Mandy Rice-Davies earned her place in the modern books of quotations when asked in court (Profumo case) whether she knew that Lord Astor had denied having sex with her. She replied: "He would say that, wouldn't he?"

Yes, I'm perfectly aware of what Mandy Rice-Davies said, I just can't see by what contortions, however witty, it relates to what I said.

The photo, incidentally, is of the lovely Joanne Whalley, who played Christine Keeler.

I don’t think you can get away with a Del Boy approach to international trade which is what you are suggesting. Since leave are fond of three word slogans how about more.

“Deliver the promises!”

rather than

“Give them excuses!”

I don't think anyone is making excuses.

So another poorly negotiated and agreed deal with the EU and now we blame the EU for us agreeing with it. Seems like we agreed a lot of things just to get Brexit and worry about the consequences latter, maybe when COVID has passed us by.

Sure, very poorly conceived and negotiated, and the British side utterly failed to see that the EU would make it a matter of honour (the wrong word, because there is no honour in this) to implement it to the letter. So it isn't working, is smashing the GFA, and therefore needs changing.

I can't see how you lot are so determined not to grasp that the thing is a disaster, that the EU is insisting upon a blinkered, spiteful and completely unnecessary 'to-the-letter' legalistic implementation which is smashing head first into the GFA, and that it has therefore to be either changed or scrapped.

The intention of the Irish Sea checks is to prevent 'goods at risk' of crossing into the SM/CU without relevant SPS checks or duties from doing so. Food supplies in Sainsburys lorries for delivery to Sainsburys supermarkets do not constitute risk. The earth on seed potatoes and tractor tyres do not constitute any more of a sanitary risk than they did prior to brexit, neither does the dog belonging to Mrs Flanagan of Ballymena returning from seeing her daughter in Norfolk, the parcel sent by her daughter to her, nor the prize heffer of farmer Simpson of Coleraine returning home from the Royal Agricultural Showground at Stoneleigh.

Only a fraction of the goods entering NI are destined for the RoI, it should be very clear what consignments they are, and the checks should be confined to those consignments which are obviously 'at risk'. Anything else is simply absurd, most particularly taken against the current background of complete alignment. It really just exposes the EU for the sham that it is.
 
If you have an issue with me make a report to Tony, or alternatively send me a PM and we can discuss any post I’ve made you believe is trolling.

No issues at all. I don't think I have ever reported a post.

You're perfectly at liberty to post whatever you want (according to the AUP) - we all are.
 
Yes, I'm perfectly aware of what Mandy Rice-Davies said, I just can't see by what contortions, however witty, it relates to what I said.

The photo, incidentally, is of the lovely Joanne Whalley, who played Christine Keeler.



I don't think anyone is making excuses.



Sure, very poorly conceived and negotiated, and the British side utterly failed to see that the EU would make it a matter of honour (the wrong word, because there is no honour in this) to implement it to the letter. So it isn't working, is smashing the GFA, and therefore needs changing.

I can't see how you lot are so determined not to grasp that the thing is a disaster, that the EU is insisting upon a blinkered, spiteful and completely unnecessary 'to-the-letter' legalistic implementation which is smashing head first into the GFA, and that it has therefore to be either changed or scrapped.

The intention of the Irish Sea checks is to prevent 'goods at risk' of crossing into the SM/CU without relevant SPS checks or duties from doing so. Food supplies in Sainsburys lorries for delivery to Sainsburys supermarkets do not constitute risk. The earth on seed potatoes and tractor tyres do not constitute any more of a sanitary risk than they did prior to brexit, neither does the dog belonging to Mrs Flanagan of Ballymena returning from seeing her daughter in Norfolk, the parcel sent by her daughter to her, nor the prize heffer of farmer Simpson of Coleraine returning home from the Royal Agricultural Showground at Stoneleigh.

Only a fraction of the goods entering NI are destined for the RoI, it should be very clear what consignments they are, and the checks should be confined to those consignments which are obviously 'at risk'. Anything else is simply absurd, most particularly taken against the current background of complete alignment. It really just exposes the EU for the sham that it is.
The bit in bold...it truly is a mystery why people are unable to accept it needs to be changed. Yes, it was negotiated and agreed, but when later it is found that something does not work, surely the thing to do is get round a table and thrash out an agreement that does?
 
I agree with a lot that you say about the Brexit deal and te EU attitude towards it eternumviti but why the xxxx Would our politicians go along with a shit deal. I would never sign an agreement for anything on the bases that I can always break it or renegotiate in six months time. This was supposed to be such a big thing with us ruling the world again. How you trust a bunch of shits like the Conservatives or any of the other shower
 
I agree with a lot that you say about the Brexit deal and te EU attitude towards it eternumviti but why the xxxx Would our politicians go along with a shit deal. I would never sign an agreement for anything on the bases that I can always break it or renegotiate in six months time. This was supposed to be such a big thing with us ruling the world again. How you trust a bunch of shits like the Conservatives or any of the other shower
Johnson will say whatever the person in front of him wants to hear at any particular time. To him, it’s a game. It is a travesty they are in govt.
 
Sure, very poorly conceived and negotiated, and the British side utterly failed to see that the EU would make it a matter of honour (the wrong word, because there is no honour in this) to implement it to the letter. So it isn't working, is smashing the GFA, and therefore needs changing.

I can't see how you lot are so determined not to grasp that the thing is a disaster, that the EU is insisting upon a blinkered, spiteful and completely unnecessary 'to-the-letter' legalistic implementation which is smashing head first into the GFA, and that it has therefore to be either changed or scrapped.

They didn't fail to see anything, they didn't give a toss thinking they could renege and still be guranteed the support of people like you who would be happy for them to use any such tactic against the EU. Job done. You are being totally disingenuous and not holding the UK Government to any kind of standard that you would insist on for anyone else.

So you hate the EU, we get it. But this sort if contortion is just nonsense. The time to object to the content of any agreement is not after you have signed it.
 
Mandy Rice-Davies earned her place in the modern books of quotations when asked in court (Profumo case) whether she knew that Lord Astor had denied having sex with her. She replied: "He would say that, wouldn't he?"
Nope another misquote! She actually said "Well he would, wouldn't he?" It probably sounded more like "well ee wood woodn't ee"

I knew someone who had the name Christine Keeler.............

Cheers,

DV
 
Nope another misquote! She actually said "Well he would, wouldn't he?" It probably sounded more like "well ee wood woodn't ee"

I knew someone who had the name Christine Keeler.............

Cheers,

DV

Yes I can see how that changes the meaning of what she said.
 
They didn't fail to see anything, they didn't give a toss thinking they could renege and still be guranteed the support of people like you who would be happy for them to use any such tactic against the EU. Job done. You are being totally disingenuous and not holding the UK Government to any kind of standard that you would insist on for anyone else.

So you hate the EU, we get it. But this sort if contortion is just nonsense. The time to object to the content of any agreement is not after you have signed it.
Now now Steve. Those darned email alerts... :)

On the day you told me I write rude and aggressive posts the pre-edited version of this started with, “That’s bilge...”.

I found it amusing so I’m not complaining, but a bit of the ‘pots and kettles’ maybe...? None of us are perfect and we could probably all make a bit of an effort, don’t you think?
 
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