advertisement


Long shot - anyone with experience of fake chimneys?

H

hc25036

pfm Member
This is a real long shot, but I never cease to be amazed about the collective knowledge held by Fishies!

Oh - and yes, fake chimneys are a thing. We are on a small new build estate where 30% of the faux chimneys are leaking into the roof space. The developer is on the case but is being coy about the cause and simply says it can be fixed from outside when they can get up there.

We are researching these things (which were installed on request by the local planning dept for 'look and feel'), and now realise they are a constant source of issues. We have informally asked the planning dept if we can have our one removed, but no reply as yet. I've taken photos of our roof and 'chimney' and it looks like a real dog's breakfast - which would be useful ammunitioin for all of us with issues. Is there a kind Fishie who could lokk at the photos and offer an informal opinion on what might be the issue and a possible solution? Sample photos below...

5H4A4871.jpg


5H4A4872.jpg
 
Below is a picture of the fake chimney on my house (sorry low res as cropped from another pic). My one doesn't leak.
It looks to me as though the lead flashing should be over the tiles to the side rather than diverting the water underneath them and into the roof space.
Caveat is that I'm no builder. If it'll help, I can take a better photo.

IMG0024crop.jpg
 
There is nothing like enough flashing and what there is is wrongly and exceedingly poorly installed. Not even remotely close to being surprised that there is water going past.

Somewhere online there will be decent pic's of a decent job. Also, you ought to have real chimneys with proper flashing close-by - go and have a look. Even a child could determine the faults in yours by comparing.
 
Thanks both. We were concerned about the flashing to the sides and some internet digging came up with several different designs, and as yet not our specifc chimney. Bizarrely, the drawings submitted to Planning show no flashing at the sides!
 
Note that's not actually surprising, drawings for planning are done very early/typically do not show final detailing.

I bet that 'chimney is a grp box with brick slips glued to it. The weakest point as you have picked-up , is the abutment either side with the ridge. That looks pretty hopeless, there's no soaker under the ridge tile and so forth.
 
Oh, and as Martin implies, the solution is to remove a few tiles and rebuild it properly according to whatever standards apply. As the builder says this can be done from the outside (must be, FWIW) when it's safe to get someone up there. I'm not a roofer, architect or civil engineer, but I know when I look at a construction the ones that work don't have gaps in them. Yours has visible gaps, guess what, it lets the rain in.
 
hc25036 said:
We are researching these things (which were installed on request by the local planning dept for 'look and feel'), and now realise they are a constant source of issues. We have informally asked the planning dept if we can have our one removed, but no reply as yet.
Click to expand...

We have real chimneys so can see that the flashing is poor. What if you 'accidentally' knocked the chimney off - would the planners insist upon reinstatement ?

CHE
 
CHE said:
We have real chimneys so can see that the flashing is poor. What if you 'accidentally' knocked the chimney off - would the planners insist upon reinstatement ?

CHE
Click to expand...
That's a lot of work when for a new build you can just pick up the phone and say "May I suggest that you get your roofer round and fix this leaky roof now before I get my solicitor/the NHBC to do you?". Once fixed there's no reason for it to last any less than the rest of the roof. I live in a 30 year old house, I've just had a ridge tile blow off and I've replaced it. The rest of the roof is perfect and I am sure it still will be fine in another 30 years. By then I won't care.
 
If your house / estate is a relatively new build you are likely to have NHBC insurance.
It is worth checking and I think they have a technical assistance department.
 
JimmyB said:
If you see them go up with a mastic gun to 'repair' it, pull the ladder away......
Click to expand...
Well, I'd be asking for his RAMS before I would authorise work. As the homeowner I have a vicarious responsibility to ensure that the worker is not endangering themselves, as far as I can reasonably be expected to tell. That means I have to know what work is to be undertaken and how the worker intends to establish a safe system of work (SSW) and secure and safe access to the work area. A ladder is an acceptable means of access only for minor repairs. As any fule kno. Substantial works involve scaffolding, and this has to be reflected in the RAMS. Of course, any responsible builder would have prepared a RAMS, wouldn't he?
 
Again many thanks for the comments and advice. It turns out that the chimneys were installed by the builder and not the roofing contractor! We are just inside our two year guarantee and the builder says they will do the repair. Really, I need pointers to be able to mark their work.....

I’ve already added a note that mastic doesn’t equal building..:)
 
I am not an expert but it looks like they have stuck the chimney on after the fact where as the Daves looks more like it was done as part of the roof build.

Did the builder do the tiles as well btw?
 
hc25036 said:
Again many thanks for the comments and advice. It turns out that the chimneys were installed by the builder and not the roofing contractor! We are just inside our two year guarantee and the builder says they will do the repair. Really, I need pointers to be able to mark their work.....

I’ve already added a note that mastic doesn’t equal building..:)
Click to expand...
Just ask for a RAMS. (Risk Assessment & Method Statement). This lays down exactly what operations are to be undertaken and how the safety and quality of the work will be ensured. If his RAMS is rubbish, reject it. If the worker fails to follow the instructions in the RAMS then you are entitled (obliged, if this were a commercial property and you had responsibility for the building) to insist that the worker stops work and if necessary comes down if he is in danger. This is why builders whinge on about H&S and have at best a fractious relationship with site engineers and facilities managers. In addition to people like me who insist (the bloody imposition!) that what they are doing will not put building debris or metal in the food in the factory.
 
We are keeping our powder dry with the NHBC as we our experience with them on another case was heavily weighted to the builder.

garyi said:
I am not an expert but it looks like they have stuck the chimney on after the fact where as the Daves looks more like it was done as part of the roof build.

Did the builder do the tiles as well btw?
Click to expand...

Good spot - the chimneys were not installed at the same time as the roofs. The tiles were done by the roofer - who we have been in contact with about some other snagging and who has been very good. I believe he was unimpressed with the chimneys...
 
stevec67 said:
Well, I'd be asking for his RAMS before I would authorise work. As the homeowner I have a vicarious responsibility to ensure that the worker is not endangering themselves, as far as I can reasonably be expected to tell. That means I have to know what work is to be undertaken and how the worker intends to establish a safe system of work (SSW) and secure and safe access to the work area. A ladder is an acceptable means of access only for minor repairs. As any fule kno. Substantial works involve scaffolding, and this has to be reflected in the RAMS. Of course, any responsible builder would have prepared a RAMS, wouldn't he?
Click to expand...

Yup, I only knew this because my neighbor who is an ex-director of a building firm told us when another neighbor had some dodgy work done. How a little old lady is supposed to know she has a responsibility for the geezer up a ladder and know what a RAMS should look like is beyond me. (Luckily we have my neighbor who misses nothing to keep any guys working up our street in line....)
 
JimmyB said:
Yup, I only knew this because my neighbor who is an ex-director of a building firm told us when another neighbor had some dodgy work done. How a little old lady is supposed to know she has a responsibility for the geezer up a ladder and know what a RAMS should look like is beyond me. (Luckily we have my neighbor who misses nothing to keep any guys working up our street in line....)
Click to expand...
Like the rest of us, the little old lady has to take reasonable care. It's no different from the French Samaritan law. In France you have to assist a person in danger as far as is reasonably practicable. Nobody expects a granny to jump into the sea to save a drowning man, but she can ring the coastguard without endangering herself. Conversely an off-duty lifeguard can do a lot more. The same goes for your little old lady - she isn't expected to know much. However if the Director of Health and Safety at Tarmac Construction gets someone in at home to replace a slate then he'd better be very sure that they are not going to fall off.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.


advertisement


Back
Top