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Scottish Politics

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Thanks for explaining your position which is clear though some of your assumptions, conclusions and view of Britain’s global ambitions seem a little odd to me. Might I ask where outside Scotland you are living.

Berkshire. For the last 11 years.

Prior to that I spent over a decade in Somerset, though in the middle of that I had a couple of years back home in Lanarkshire where the kids suffered badly at school for their English accents, even though my daughter had been born in Glasgow (my son was born in Bristol).

Moving to Scotland with a foreign wife and English-accented kids was an eye opener. I saw an ugly side to Scottish culture that hadn't been apparent to me before. 'Jokes' that simply weren't funny. Kids acting out on newcomers at school the bigotry they routinely heard at home. Casual anti-Englishness from people I used to think were civilised. I could go on.

My experience is that all of the above has got steadily worse over recent years and I blame the SNP primarily - it's undoubtedly a strategy of theirs to poison the well of civility.

I can tell you now that the English are streets ahead of the Scots in accepting strangers (in which category they barely even put Scottish people - something that is certainly not reciprocated).
 
There’s an elegant contradiction between Brexit and Scotland becoming independent. England votes by a majority to leave the EU yet it seems many of the same voters are outraged that Scotland is exercising its desire to leave the U.K. in order to take its place in the EU again. That same contradiction oozes out when you hear expressions like - Scotland can’t leave the U.K. because (for example) it’ll be destroyed economically yet those expressing that view are simultaneously outraged by voters in Scotland exercising their choice.
It’s seemed to me since 2016 that Independence is an inevitable consequence of Brexit. We can find out how widely held that view is in the May election.
 
There’s an elegant contradiction between Brexit and Scotland becoming independent. England votes by a majority to leave the EU yet it seems many of the same voters are outraged that Scotland is exercising its desire to leave the U.K. in order to take its place in the EU again. That same contradiction oozes out when you hear expressions like - Scotland can’t leave the U.K. because (for example) it’ll be destroyed economically yet those expressing that view are simultaneously outraged by voters in Scotland exercising that choice.
It’s seemed to me since 2016 that Independence is an inevitable consequence of Brexit. We can find out how widely held that view is in the May election.
Why call it a contradiction? It’s an ironic parallel. In both cases ideology (in this case a desire for some form of perceived independence) trumps mere economics.
 
There’s an elegant contradiction between Brexit and Scotland becoming independent. England votes by a majority to leave the EU yet it seems many of the same voters are outraged that Scotland is exercising its desire to leave the U.K. in order to take its place in the EU again. That same contradiction oozes out when you hear expressions like - Scotland can’t leave the U.K. because (for example) it’ll be destroyed economically yet those expressing that view are simultaneously outraged by voters in Scotland exercising that choice.
It’s seemed to me since 2016 that Independence is an inevitable consequence of Brexit. We can find out how widely held that view is in the May election.

It's a false equivalence, though I can see it could be made at a shallow level. (And much of the debate is, indeed, pretty shallow).
 
As if economics weren’t ideological.

I have just been watching footage of de Valera and been reminded of what even insurgent nationalism means without an ideological commitment to dealing with economic problems. Impossible to blame Scotland for wanting to get away from the death cult across the border but it looks to me like the SNP are going to be absolutely zero help once the cord has been cut. Such obvious shysters.
 
It would be informative for members to see what constitutes the active counter demonstration to independence in Scotland. At independence rallies there are small groups of protesters consisting of about 50, waving Union Jacks and chanting. The last one in Glasgow was led by an ex-UKIP, Holocaust denier and religious bigot. The small gathering consisted of members of far right groups, the Orange Order and sectarian football supporters. The double ring of police surrounding them is there to contain them.

During the slaver monument demonstrations in Edinburgh, the same characters turned up as guardians of the monuments, tiny in number and closely chaperoned by the police. At the same time death threats are made against the Scottish justice minister- a Muslim and his family. The threats originate from social media accounts linked to the same organisations above.
Tommy Robinson arrived in Glasgow to join up with them in order to cause civil disorder in the Muslim area of south Glasgow.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/former-ukip-member-holocaust-denier-21377252
 
the kids suffered badly at school for their English accents

Yup, it's a bad side of Scotland. Despite being born at Bellshill maternity, my Northumbrian parents meant I have what was considered a 'posh' English accent at school and it was a constant source of bullying. Ironically my elder bro who was born in Manchester has a more Scottish accent and was fine.

I'd say the west is worse for it than the east from personal experience. I now live just outside Edinburgh and I'm seen as a weegie.

Nothing to do with the SNP though. Yes there are a few rabid nationalists but it's deeper than that.
 
It would be informative for members to see what constitutes the active counter demonstration to independence in Scotland. At independence rallies there are small groups of protesters consisting of about 50, waving Union Jacks and chanting. The last one in Glasgow was led by an ex-UKIP, Holocaust denier and religious bigot. The small gathering consisted of members of far right groups, the Orange Order and sectarian football supporters. The double ring of police surrounding them is there to contain them.

During the slaver monument demonstrations in Edinburgh, the same characters turned up as guardians of the monuments, tiny in number and closely chaperoned by the police. At the same time death threats are made against the Scottish justice minister- a Muslim and his family. The threats originate from social media accounts linked to the same organisations above.
Tommy Robinson arrived in Glasgow to join up with them in order to cause civil disorder in the Muslim area of south Glasgow.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/former-ukip-member-holocaust-denier-21377252


Your point being? Surely not that these idiots are representative of the 55% of the SNP-gerrymandered electorate who told Salmond to naff off last time?
 
It would be informative for members to see what constitutes the active counter demonstration to independence in Scotland. At independence rallies there are small groups of protesters consisting of about 50, waving Union Jacks and chanting. The last one in Glasgow was led by a UKIP, Holocaust denier and religious bigot. The small gathering consisted of members of far right groups, the Orange Order and sectarian football supporters. The double ring of police surrounding them is there to contain them.

During the slaver monument demonstrations in Edinburgh, the same characters turned up as guardians of the monuments, tiny in number and closely chaperoned by the police. At the same time death threats are made against the Scottish justice minister- a Muslim and his family. The threats originate from social media accounts linked to the same organisations above.
Tommy Robinson arrived in Glasgow to join up with them in order to cause civil disorder in the Muslim area of south Glasgow.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/former-ukip-member-holocaust-denier-21377252
Sure. Who else will make the case for being wed to England, one of the worst, stupidest, ugliest, most dangerous places in the world right now? The problem is that the SNP don’t really seem to have much to offer other than not being English. Obviously it’s a start, but...
 
Point being, there is no pro- Brexit, pro- union political movement in Scotland. The parties representing that position are (added together) in a tiny minority. Labour down to a single seat, six Tories and four Liberals vs 48 SNP MPs in the Commons. Polling is now showing the majority want independence and that there’s going to be an eye catching result in the May election, even before we factor in the consequences of Brexit next January and the continued assistance from Boris Johnson.
 
Sure. Who else will make the case for being wed to England, one of the worst, stupidest, ugliest, most dangerous places in the world right now? The problem is that the SNP don’t really seem to have much to offer other than not being English. Obviously it’s a start, but...
You must have read a different programme for government and SNP 2019 election manifesto from the rest of us up here Sean. Actually you might be forgiven for thinking the sole remaining Labour MP has anti-Independence as his single manifesto idea. Things have moved on, they’re not going to go back to where they were- people who’ve reached voting age in the past six years are making very different political choices. Scottish politics will be dominated by the SNP and Greens.
 
But at least it's is ours to change should the electorate decide. If there's no way to throw the ****ers out, then it isn't democracy.
Christ, not wheeling that tired UKIP cr4p out again.
Listen, the lot we have in have killed more of us in the UK than the entire EU body count.
Be a good chap and vote them out, will you? NOW, before they beat their own record with the second wave?
There is adequate democracy in the EU, and since 2016 it has performed considerably better than ours.
Just jog my memory about that EU prorogation of parliament, will you?
That EU assumption of Henry V111 powers?
The EU breaking international law to renege on a treaty?
 
Christ, not wheeling that tired UKIP cr4p out again.
Listen, the lot we have in have killed more of us in the UK than the entire EU body count.
Be a good chap and vote them out, will you? NOW, before they beat their own record with the second wave?
There is adequate democracy in the EU, and since 2016 it has performed considerably better than ours.
Just jog my memory about that EU prorogation of parliament, will you?
That EU assumption of Henry V111 powers?
The EU breaking international law to renege on a treaty?

Ah, diddums.

Don't forget the blood pressure tablets.
 
Ah, diddums.

Don't forget the blood pressure tablets.
Reasoned reply...you go up in my estimation.
However, joking apart, zero addressing of the points I made, and I seem to have had zero response from you regarding your views on expats and referenda.
Maybe time for some more distracting willy waving about how many languages you speak and who your favourite dead German librettist is.
I can hardly wait.
 
There's no reasoning with closed minded zealots, whether they be lobotomised SNP supporters or long-term sufferers from Brexit Derangement Syndrome. I'll stick to the classifieds. Bye now.
On your part, there was no reasoning. I offered valid arguments, which you spectacularly failed to rise to.
Or maybe you did.
 
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