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Brexit: give me a positive effect... III

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Nigel is correct; the days of the smug smiles of Juncker and Barnier are long gone, all they can do now is threaten is it will hurt you more than it will hurt us. That is trade war talk and they will probably find they were correct that they will hurt our economy but they cannot blockade containers supplying goods from outside of the EU. Neither side will benefit from a trade war except of course other countries outside Europe.
It will not come to this because we are all basically broke, and a not BINO deal is on the way.
We brexited, we weren't thrown out, as such we have hurt our own economy. Even some of the architects of this shambles have admitted we will take a hit (ignoring the earlier rosy sales pitch).

Whatever your feelings about fish and the each I'm sure you will agree that trade flowed quite well ( leaving aside our own traffic problems). Any increased costs or interruptions to a properly functioning system are down to us.

We knew the rules or at least should have known them.
 
You may not have intended to Brian, but you’ve certainly given me the impression of voting Brexit and quite rabidly so. But at the very least you have been looking for reasons to remain, without making a case for the benefits you expect from a project that has already cost more than we spent on contributions and bitterly divided the country, especially the opposition to the Tories, which has obviously delighted them.

I come at it from the point that of view that it’s up to people advocating an expensive and disruptive change to make a case for it, no matter what the subject. Not for the status quo to prove negatives.
Steve,

I wouldn’t disagree those advocating change should be making the case, however, in relation to 2016 the remain campaign failed to get across the regional benefits of EU membership. To me, campaigning on negative predictions versus positive facts was a huge mistake.

Edit: I would say if I have a rabid dislike of anything it is tory ideology, I’ve never had any strong feeling about the EU similar to how I would like to see the demise and disappearance of the tory party.
 
May I suggest then that you phone a friend? Brian would do. He's prosocial.

Why should I ask Brian or anyone else? You made the charge that I am apparently 'projecting'. I think it might just be a word that you like the sound of, so either back it up, or zip it up, and perhaps provide a retraction whilst you're at it..
 
Apologies if I got the wrong end of the stick, but my impression of your views over the years has been one of EU scepticism, albeit in a "I am not convinced by this until someone can explain why I am wrong" rather than from a bad faith (like the radical free marketeers) or ideological (like the ultras) basis.

The Tories are, of course, responsible for Brexit as the whole thing is a result of their obsession. But people who voted for Brexit are also responsible, in fact literally so, if only because they fell into the the Tories trap.
It was Foot and Ben in the early days pointing out the 'not democracy as we know it' nature of the lack of accountability of the EEC council that would change into the ECJ and Heath pushing for more Europe.
 
Absolutely. The 'tory trap' was the one set, painstakingly and over most of two decades, by Heath and his old boss Macmillan.

It involved careful use of both sorts of lie, commission and omission.
 
Why should I ask Brian or anyone else? You made the charge that I am apparently 'projecting'. I think it might just be a word that you like the sound of, so either back it up, or zip it up, and perhaps provide a retraction whilst you're at it..

Highfalutin as well.
 
Nigel is correct; the days of the smug smiles of Juncker and Barnier are long gone, all they can do now is threaten is it will hurt you more than it will hurt us. That is trade war talk and they will probably find they were correct that they will hurt our economy but they cannot blockade containers supplying goods from outside of the EU. Neither side will benefit from a trade war except of course other countries outside Europe.
It will not come to this because we are all basically broke, and a not BINO deal is on the way.
A customs border is ‘trade war talk’? That’s simply the product of Brexit, of leaving the single market. We’ve left, gerroverit.
Now one benefit is there could be jobs counting the lorries in Kent. No previous experience needed, must be able to operate a clicker. Rainwear will be provided.
 
A customs border is ‘trade war talk’? That’s simply the product of Brexit, of leaving the single market. We’ve left, gerroverit.
Now one benefit is there could be jobs counting the lorries in Kent. No previous experience needed, must be able to operate a clicker. Rainwear will be provided.
I wonder how much of this traffic can be transferred to container ports?
 
We brexited, we weren't thrown out, as such we have hurt our own economy. Even some of the architects of this shambles have admitted we will take a hit (ignoring the earlier rosy sales pitch).

Whatever your feelings about fish and the ecjI I'm sure you will agree that trade flowed quite well ( leaving aside our own traffic problems). Any increased costs or interruptions to a properly functioning system are down to us.

We knew the rules or at least should have known them.
 
At a guess i would think as we have moved from EEC towards a Federal Europe, popularity for the project has diminished along the way.
Bollocks.
The average person hadn't a care or clue , knew zero about the EU and didn't vote in the EU elections.
But when the EU decided to target multinational entities and individuals who operated with disregard for borders to minimise their already minimal tax contribution, those same targets who have extensive media interests or the ability to manipulate it decided to act.
Over the years they had, as something of an insurance policy, been dripping untruths and poison against the EU, everything from straight bananas to lies about the ECJ. And now came the time to capitalise on this groundwork.
So the social media stuff, the whiffy nazi referencing posters, the targetted russian bots (yes Putin was glad to hitch a ride and enjoy the destruction).
And enough of the simple folk who read the mail, the express et al, who listened to farage on his mystifyingly frequent bbc appearances and who were in receipt of this odure were taken in.
The ref was a snapshot of a moment, just favourable enough to swing it.
They never dared have a ratifying ref, and numbers since have always shown no majority, even the election, where the tories won most seats, but only because the remain oppostion was split - numbers voting gave remain a significant majority.
So, yeah, bollocks mate.
 
^ many Brexiteers voted for a rose-tinted image of England that cannot be recreated, if it ever existed.
There will be many disappointments and casualties.
There are already articles about how Covid plus Brexit will reduce the UK economic status towards the bottom of the OECD.
 
^ many Brexiteers voted for a rose-tinted image of England that cannot be recreated, if it ever existed.
There will be many disappointments and casualties.
There are already articles about how Covid plus Brexit will reduce the UK economic status towards the bottom of the OECD.
How many of the 17.2m is many?

Do you have an example of what this rose-tinted image ‘many’ voted for looks like and do you have actual evidence people voted for it and in massive numbers?

In 4 years I haven’t seen any real evidence anywhere that shows clearly why 17.2m voted leave. I suspect there are many different reasons, but you never know, perhaps this rose-tinted image will account for millions of the 17.2m.
 
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