Active hi-fi speakers vs active studio monitors for Linn Akurate DSM

[NL]

Hi Guys,

I have migrated recently from Majik to Akurate DSM and now I consider changes in amplification and speakrs area. I currently use Majik 2100 power amp and Majik 140 speakers (with LP12 and Naim CD5 XS as a sources).

Lately I have been very curious about active speakers. Unfortunately active Linn Akubariks are very expensive and, which is even more important, make a sort of dead end for further system evolution... as new Linns have special connections (exakt) which only work with Linn preamps.

On the other hand, there are a number of studio monitor brands on the market in Serbia, with reasonable pricing too (eg. Neumann KH 310 ARG, PSI audio A25, Focal trio 11) There are also more expensive alternatives such Dutch & Dutch 8c, ATC SCM40A, SCM50 ASL... but even these more expensive are less expensive than Linn Akubariks... and I seriously doubt their performance to be inferior to Akubariks.

To be honest, my gut feeling is telling me ATC 50 ASL would be a dream combo...

I would appreciate your thoughts and experience on this matter.

Cheers!
NL.

 

[NL]

Subject should of course read hifi, not hihi...

 

[Purité Audio]

There is only one way to find out, you have to compare in your room side by side.
Keith

 

[9designs]

Why would you not make your 140's aktiv or even Exakt? .. You don't need to change your speakers, they have a lot more to give.

 

[Nero]

I ran a KlimaxDS into ATC 50ASLs for a while (I had a Kontrol too but you don’t need a preamp I think) and I only changed to 100ASLs to get more of the same. If the Akurate has Katalyst, it’s a good source for ATC

 

[NL]

There is only one way to find out, you have to compare in your room side by side.
Keith

Thats very true, thanks. Unfortunately, there is no Linn dealer in Serbia for more than 2 years now, so I don't realy have a chance to hear Akubariks in my listening room. Thats a pitty. Other alternatives I could hear... and most probably I will.

 

[Purité Audio]

If you can find any measurements for the speakers you are interested in, they can help narrow down the list of ‘possibles’.
Keith

 

[NL]

Why would you not make your 140's aktiv or even Exakt? .. You don't need to change your speakers, they have a lot more to give.

Also true, many thanks. This is an alternative path which Im also considering curently. It includes the whole "amplification story" with in total 8ch of amplification, active cards for the amps... or the exaktbox (digital crossover), plus some 40m of speaker cables (20m per speaker). All in all, the cost effectiness of this approach has turned to be higly questionable. Its more easy and less expensive to buy speakers with imbedded amps, just need long balanced XLR cables...
Im not really shure about it... this is why I have opened a topic on this... to descuss and see other opinions and thoughts, especially since I lack expiriance.

 

[9designs]

Yep add a 6100 and cards.
Or an Majik Exakt box with it's own 8 channel power amps built in, which you could position close to the speakers and run the longer length of network cable to it.

 

[NL]

I ran a KlimaxDS into ATC 50ASLs for a while (I had a Kontrol too but you don’t need a preamp I think) and I only changed to 100ASLs to get more of the same. If the Akurate has Katalyst, it’s a good source for ATC

Thanks. Yes indeed, my Akurate DSM/3 has Katalyst arhitecture DAC inside. It is streamer and the preamp, so I would only need active speakers and long balanced cables...
Im particurarly interested in ATCs as they are widely preised, in Serbia also, and they could be conected to any preamp with balanced output. On the other hand, Linn with its exakt connections could be driven only by the Linn preamp...

 

[tuga]

Hi Guys,

I have migrated recently from Majik to Akurate DSM and now I consider changes in amplification and speakrs area. I currently use Majik 2100 power amp and Majik 140 speakers (with LP12 and Naim CD5 XS as a sources).

Lately I have been very curious about active speakers. Unfortunately active Linn Akubariks are very expensive and, which is even more important, make a sort of dead end for further system evolution... as new Linns have special connections (exakt) which only work with Linn preamps.

On the other hand, there are a number of studio monitor brands on the market in Serbia, with reasonable pricing too (eg. Neumann KH 310 ARG, PSI audio A25, Focal trio 11) There are also more expensive alternatives such Dutch & Dutch 8c, ATC SCM40A, SCM50 ASL... but even these more expensive are less expensive than Linn Akubariks... and I seriously doubt their performance to be inferior to Akubariks.

To be honest, my gut feeling is telling me ATC 50 ASL would be a dream combo...

I would appreciate your thoughts and experience on this matter.

Cheers!
NL.

Genelec, Neumann, PSI, Dutch & Dutch, Kii are all very accurate speakers, if you are looking for accurate reproduction of the recorded signal that is the way to go.

 

[NL]

Yep add a 6100 and cards.
Or an Majik Exakt box with it's own 8 channel power amps built in, which you could position close to the speakers and run the longer length of network cable to it.

Yes, I have seriously considered that option too. But then, my Katalyst DAC imbedded in Akurate DSM would be redundant... in fact, using less advanced DAC imbedded in Majik Exaktbox.

 

[NL]

Genelec, Neumann, PSI, Dutch & Dutch, Kii are all very accurate speakers, if you are looking for accurate reproduction of the recorded signal that is the way to go.

You got my point, many thanks. Yet some friends of mine are trying to convine me listening to extremely accurate speakers for prolonged time is not as pleasent as I think at all, rather could make one tired quickly. But from my side, as I beleive in the source centric audio sistem, its a kind of natural choice to pick accurate and transparent speaker... which will help the true music procuction to shine as it should shine...

 

[tuga]

You got my point, many thanks. Yet some friends of mine are trying to convine me listening to extremely accurate speakers for prolonged time is not as pleasent as I think at all, rather could make one tired quickly. But from my side, as I beleive in the source centric audio sistem, its a kind of natural choice to pick accurate and transparent speaker... which will help the true music procuction to shine as it should shine...

In my experience some types of distortion cause fatigue whilst others are pleasing to the ear (euphonic) or forgiving of poor recordings or other equipment which produces distortion that causes fatigue.
Accuracy is absence of distortion so there is no reason why it should cause fatigue.

 

[John Phillips]

... Yet some friends of mine are trying to convine me listening to extremely accurate speakers for prolonged time is not as pleasent as I think at all, rather could make one tired quickly. But from my side, as I beleive in the source centric audio sistem, its a kind of natural choice to pick accurate and transparent speaker... which will help the true music procuction to shine as it should shine...

I have some experience which might be relevant to this point. With loudspeakers I used to have I found there was a definite limit to the sound level I found comfortable. Any more and the sound became fatiguing.

I replaced them with loudspeakers which were capable of higher sound levels. The sound became cleaner and more natural to me and that fatigue at high sound levels disappeared. To begin with I found myself playing at higher sound levels but over time I gradually returned to my usual sound levels.

Frequency response is just one element of loudspeaker performance and it gets, IMHO, over-emphasised compared to other performance issues. At least of equal importance to me is that professional-monitor-type loudspeakers typically have higher sound level capability before level compression happens and distortion rises. Some, like me, experience this as cleaner non-fatiguing sound at normal sound levels. However, I do observe that others experience this as thin and unpleasant sound - the opposite of my experience. So I suspect you will have to try it out yourself and decide what you like.

 

[igor_xxxx]

Yet some friends of mine are trying to convine me listening to extremely accurate speakers for prolonged time is not as pleasent as I think at all, rather could make one tired quickly.

Probably you know my system from the local forum (Neumann KH310 and stereo KH750s), and although I don't like to generalize when it comes to personal preferences, I can assure you that I am listening to my system for hours every day, without any "fatigue".

I also have to add that my room does have some acoustic treatment and a lot of soft furnishings, books, shelves and etc., and this made a noticeable difference.

@John Phillips' explanation exactly mirrors my experience as well.

 

[NL]

Frequency response is just one element of loudspeaker performance and it gets, IMHO, over-emphasised compared to other performance issues. At least of equal importance to me is that professional-monitor-type loudspeakers typically have higher sound level capability before level compression happens and distortion rises. Some, like me, experience this as cleaner non-fatiguing sound at normal sound levels. However, I do observe that others experience this as thin and unpleasant sound - the opposite of my experience. So I suspect you will have to try it out yourself and decide what you like.

Thanks, thats all true. For a shorter listening sessions I have no doubt I prefer cleaner and somewhat more analytical sound of monitiors. But I didn't so far listen monitors for prolonged periods, simply I didn't have an oportunity to do so. My plan now is to find dealers who would let me hear demo monitors at my home...

 

[NL]

Probably you know my system from the local forum (Neumann KH310 and stereo KH750s), and although I don't like to generalize when it comes to personal preferences, I can assure you that I am listening to my system for hours every day, without any "fatigue".

I also have to add that my room does have some acoustic treatment and a lot of soft furnishings, books, shelves and etc., and this made a noticeable difference.

@John Phillips' explanation exactly mirrors my experience as well.

Thanks Igor. Of course I now your system, I have read many posts about it. To be honest, those readings also inspired me to look at the active studio monitors niche more seroiusly and to consider it as an alternative for my way forward.

 

[AndyU]

Hi Guys,

I have migrated recently from Majik to Akurate DSM and now I consider changes in amplification and speakrs area. I currently use Majik 2100 power amp and Majik 140 speakers (with LP12 and Naim CD5 XS as a sources).

Lately I have been very curious about active speakers. Unfortunately active Linn Akubariks are very expensive and, which is even more important, make a sort of dead end for further system evolution... as new Linns have special connections (exakt) which only work with Linn preamps.

On the other hand, there are a number of studio monitor brands on the market in Serbia, with reasonable pricing too (eg. Neumann KH 310 ARG, PSI audio A25, Focal trio 11) There are also more expensive alternatives such Dutch & Dutch 8c, ATC SCM40A, SCM50 ASL... but even these more expensive are less expensive than Linn Akubariks... and I seriously doubt their performance to be inferior to Akubariks.

To be honest, my gut feeling is telling me ATC 50 ASL would be a dream combo...

I would appreciate your thoughts and experience on this matter.

Cheers!
NL.

The ATCSs are wonderful, a magnificent way of making tremendous music in your home, I have the 50ASLTS so I am biased. But they are big, heavy, and expensive. I’ve tried the KH310s twice at home, they are a good bit cheaper and more than competent, and the options with the active sub are potentially powerful. I could live with them, they are very neutral, and have a superbly accurate stereo image, but the bass limits quite easily and earlier than I would want. The sub would change that I am sure. I got one pair on trial from kmr audio, and another from Thomann.de - either might be able to help you out. The D&Ds are in vogue at the moment. I’ve heard them a couple of times, including once set up by their designer, but they did not move air in a way that moved me to buy them. Also it strikes me that the Neumann approach of separating the sub from the mains may be inherently smarter and more flexible - the optimal position for a sub/subs is rarely in the same position as the mains.

 

[NL]

Thanks @AndyU , I'll try to manage somehow listening of ATCs. Please tell me what listening room dimensions you consider minimal for ATC50ASL ? My room measures 5x5m, about 25m2 - is it too small? In my mind those ATCs are ultimate choice...

On the other hand side, D&D look more compact in size, and no doubt they have fancy and modern appearance... in my opinion they look more like home hifi than studio pro equipment...

As for the KH310s, I agree their performance and cost effectivness are very good, yet if you add subs, they are more robust that ATCs... but they include DSP and bass management.

As my Linn ADSM has "Space optimisation", which is a sort of Linns' DSP, with recognition of ATCs, I think that should work more than fine even in the smaller room like mine.