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Lost in audio
So, you decided to let go of the Tannoys in favor of the small boxes? That's quite a swing from huge to tiny! What, in your listening experience, prompted that move?
LS3/5a -inspired monitors that you have owned, ranked by preference
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Nagraboy
Ausculta fili
I didn’t like the extra bass from the Tannoys which I felt might annoy the neighbours, and didn’t like the vocals compared with Harbeth either. The voices sounded oddly-textured compared to the more human-sounding Harbeth. Also, I didn’t get much range of the volume control with my Leben valve amp with the Tannoys. Also, I could hear hum from the Leben more loudly with Tannoys because of the higher sensitivity. It was to do with the mains in my house, not a inherent problem with Leben amps. So yeah, a few reasons!
I’m not ready for final ranking yet,...For now, in order of purchase:
1. Harbeth P3ES-2. Just before the Radial driver was put into the little guys. Close to 15 years old now; still a benchmark for me. Look great, sound beautifully balanced across a wide range of music, unfussy about stands or desktop, and a succession of integrated (mostly) amps and one-box solutions.
2. Graham LS3/5. (Not their LS3/5a) Nothing bad to say about them; well made, great mids and voices of course, just didn’t do better for me than the Harbs. The Grahams seemed more like a studio monitor to me, saw deeper and more ruthlessly into the mix with all its flaws. Perhaps the Harbs gave up some of that accuracy, if that’s what it is, for entertainment, even a little smoothness; fine with me.
3. Stirling V3s. My current all-around favorite, with a couple of qualifications. I really haven’t gone back and forth with the Harbeths enough to draw final conclusions. Plus, I cheat with the Stirlings; adding the AB-2 Bass extenders for music, some of the time, and running the V3s on their own for TV, ‘Flix, etc. A very convenient swap; nothing has to move but the speaker wire and connecting jumpers. Early impressions are that the V3s may be more revealing in the high frequencies, at least as good in the mids and vocals, and apparently more robust bass than the Harbs, even without the Stirling Bass Extenders, which add depth to the foundation. But that is preliminary, and I don’t want to suggest the Harbs are disgraced. To me, the Stirling V3s are so seamless and well balanced across the spectrum that it tends to discourage efforts to distinguish between high-mid-low.
4. Proac Tab 10. newest member of a growing family. Somebody is going to have to move out... Might be me if SWMBO starts counting these similar little boxes....The Proacs are unique in this field; more or less the same size as the LS3/5 legacies, they make no pretence of being bound by the old BBC specs. These are spectacularly fun to listen to on pop/rock and anything more upbeat. The 3 dimensions of the soundstage are beyond the other members of the pack, at least in my room; especially height and depth. An especially lively and vivid sound; you might say sparkly, but in no bad way - they convey the excitement of music in a very open-throated, uninhibited way. Is this attributable to a simpler cross-over, or less internal damping? I’ve never heard Linn Kans, but I want to write about the Tab 10s in the way the Kans fans express themselves. I’m not sure the tones and the shadings within tones of the Tabs are quite as fully expressed and rounded as with the V3s, or as warm as Harbs. The Tab 10s seem more dynamic to me. But I’d pick the V3s if I was enjoying the differences between different makes of guitars, vihuela, lutes or theorbo, or something equally pretentious.
The foregoing may not do justice to the Harbeths - I’ve had them a long time, and the others are enjoying the tyranny of the new...
Be Well
1. Harbeth P3ES-2. Just before the Radial driver was put into the little guys. Close to 15 years old now; still a benchmark for me. Look great, sound beautifully balanced across a wide range of music, unfussy about stands or desktop, and a succession of integrated (mostly) amps and one-box solutions.
2. Graham LS3/5. (Not their LS3/5a) Nothing bad to say about them; well made, great mids and voices of course, just didn’t do better for me than the Harbs. The Grahams seemed more like a studio monitor to me, saw deeper and more ruthlessly into the mix with all its flaws. Perhaps the Harbs gave up some of that accuracy, if that’s what it is, for entertainment, even a little smoothness; fine with me.
3. Stirling V3s. My current all-around favorite, with a couple of qualifications. I really haven’t gone back and forth with the Harbeths enough to draw final conclusions. Plus, I cheat with the Stirlings; adding the AB-2 Bass extenders for music, some of the time, and running the V3s on their own for TV, ‘Flix, etc. A very convenient swap; nothing has to move but the speaker wire and connecting jumpers. Early impressions are that the V3s may be more revealing in the high frequencies, at least as good in the mids and vocals, and apparently more robust bass than the Harbs, even without the Stirling Bass Extenders, which add depth to the foundation. But that is preliminary, and I don’t want to suggest the Harbs are disgraced. To me, the Stirling V3s are so seamless and well balanced across the spectrum that it tends to discourage efforts to distinguish between high-mid-low.
4. Proac Tab 10. newest member of a growing family. Somebody is going to have to move out... Might be me if SWMBO starts counting these similar little boxes....The Proacs are unique in this field; more or less the same size as the LS3/5 legacies, they make no pretence of being bound by the old BBC specs. These are spectacularly fun to listen to on pop/rock and anything more upbeat. The 3 dimensions of the soundstage are beyond the other members of the pack, at least in my room; especially height and depth. An especially lively and vivid sound; you might say sparkly, but in no bad way - they convey the excitement of music in a very open-throated, uninhibited way. Is this attributable to a simpler cross-over, or less internal damping? I’ve never heard Linn Kans, but I want to write about the Tab 10s in the way the Kans fans express themselves. I’m not sure the tones and the shadings within tones of the Tabs are quite as fully expressed and rounded as with the V3s, or as warm as Harbs. The Tab 10s seem more dynamic to me. But I’d pick the V3s if I was enjoying the differences between different makes of guitars, vihuela, lutes or theorbo, or something equally pretentious.
The foregoing may not do justice to the Harbeths - I’ve had them a long time, and the others are enjoying the tyranny of the new...
Be Well
Martyn Miles
pfm Member
I didn’t add any speakers that I’d built.
All sold on.
Stirling replacement LS3/5a baffles. In genuine LS3/5a cabinets:
These were sublime, almost addictive.
They sounded best on an all vinyl system.
LS3/5a clones: Selected B110s & T27s with Falcon FL6/23 crossovers and
Harbeth HL-P3 cabinets.
My first clones.
I was on a ‘learning curve’ as I’d not heard LS3/5as in my own home.
They were almost as good as the Audiomasters I then bought.
LS3/5a clones: These used ex. BBC 9mm cabinets, selected B110/T27 drive units
and Falcon 23ab crossovers.
They had a slightly more ‘distant’ and less analytical sound than
the Audiomasters. Exceptionally good using an amp./tuner system.
Radio 3 was superb.
All sold on.
Stirling replacement LS3/5a baffles. In genuine LS3/5a cabinets:
These were sublime, almost addictive.
They sounded best on an all vinyl system.
LS3/5a clones: Selected B110s & T27s with Falcon FL6/23 crossovers and
Harbeth HL-P3 cabinets.
My first clones.
I was on a ‘learning curve’ as I’d not heard LS3/5as in my own home.
They were almost as good as the Audiomasters I then bought.
LS3/5a clones: These used ex. BBC 9mm cabinets, selected B110/T27 drive units
and Falcon 23ab crossovers.
They had a slightly more ‘distant’ and less analytical sound than
the Audiomasters. Exceptionally good using an amp./tuner system.
Radio 3 was superb.
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Martyn Miles
pfm Member
I can’t say I know much about the Audio Space model, but I remember reading it had been endorsed
by some of the ‘Golden Ears’ in the Far East.
Some time ago I briefly heard a model based on the Rogers 11 ohm and is was surprisingly good.
Can’t remember the manufacturer, though.
by some of the ‘Golden Ears’ in the Far East.
Some time ago I briefly heard a model based on the Rogers 11 ohm and is was surprisingly good.
Can’t remember the manufacturer, though.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Martyn Miles
pfm Member
I would love to hear the LS8s on my system.
When I saw a pair up on eBay I was sorely tempted, I can tell you !
When I saw a pair up on eBay I was sorely tempted, I can tell you !
ampedup
Lost in audio
Martyn, would you be able to contrast the sound of the Falcons with the V3s, or were they owned too far apart for you to have that memory?
Hoopsontoast
pfm Member
Keesonic Kolt - Superb little speakers, don't do any real bass below 80Hz but probably the best small speaker that actually works in a small room/on an actual bookshelf.
Harbeth P3ES (extended Loan) - Nice integration between the midbass and tweeter, seemed to miss something for me though. Tried with the matching AB bass units and felt they sounded better on their own.
Spendor S3/5R - Much like the Harbeths to be honest.
ATC SCM7 (mk2) - Great bass & dynamics (for this kind of speaker) and midrange was superb. Tweeter was the weak link, stood out, just missing something on the integration I found, same with the rest of the range at the time.
ATC SCM10 - Like the SCM7 but with a better tweeter IMO, on my third pair now and they are the least compromised small speaker I have heard, as long as you don't expect to hold a garden party with them! Amazing imaging/soundstage on top of superb integration between the mid-bass and treble.
The actual 'best' bookshelf speaker I have heard or owned was the KEF 201/2, loosely linked to the LS3/5A but worth a mention. To my ears, all the best parts of the ATC SCM10 but with headroom to spare. Quite large and need some good space around them to work their best though.
Not properly heard an actual LS3/5A other than quickly at shows.
ATC SCM10 and Keesonic Kolt for a sense of scale difference....
ATC SCM10 by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
Harbeth P3ES and Xtender by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
Spendor S3/5R by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
ATC SCM-7 Monitor by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
System by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
KEF 201/2 by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
Harbeth P3ES (extended Loan) - Nice integration between the midbass and tweeter, seemed to miss something for me though. Tried with the matching AB bass units and felt they sounded better on their own.
Spendor S3/5R - Much like the Harbeths to be honest.
ATC SCM7 (mk2) - Great bass & dynamics (for this kind of speaker) and midrange was superb. Tweeter was the weak link, stood out, just missing something on the integration I found, same with the rest of the range at the time.
ATC SCM10 - Like the SCM7 but with a better tweeter IMO, on my third pair now and they are the least compromised small speaker I have heard, as long as you don't expect to hold a garden party with them! Amazing imaging/soundstage on top of superb integration between the mid-bass and treble.
The actual 'best' bookshelf speaker I have heard or owned was the KEF 201/2, loosely linked to the LS3/5A but worth a mention. To my ears, all the best parts of the ATC SCM10 but with headroom to spare. Quite large and need some good space around them to work their best though.
Not properly heard an actual LS3/5A other than quickly at shows.
ATC SCM10 and Keesonic Kolt for a sense of scale difference....
ATC SCM10 by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
Harbeth P3ES and Xtender by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
Spendor S3/5R by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
ATC SCM-7 Monitor by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
System by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
KEF 201/2 by Robert Seymour, on Flickr
Graham H
pfm Member
Linn Kan
Spendor LS3/5a
Linn Kan II
Falcon LS3/5a
I prefer the Falcons (recent serial number, burr walnut) by quite a margin, they are keepers, although I was happier with the Kan IIs (1991 serial number) over the early Kans and Spendors. The Spendors were 1986 vintage and just didn’t sound right from new compared to other LS3/5as I’ve heard.
Spendor LS3/5a
Linn Kan II
Falcon LS3/5a
I prefer the Falcons (recent serial number, burr walnut) by quite a margin, they are keepers, although I was happier with the Kan IIs (1991 serial number) over the early Kans and Spendors. The Spendors were 1986 vintage and just didn’t sound right from new compared to other LS3/5as I’ve heard.
Martyn Miles
pfm Member
All I can really say is initially the V3s reminded me of the Falcons.
Hoopsontoast; Were those matching AB bass units made by Harbeth at the time? If so, around what time period was that?
Encyclopedic post by the way...
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Lost in audio
A beautiful tribute.
Hoopsontoast
pfm Member
I believe they were made by Harbeth, as mentioned, I had them on loan so I was not too aware of the background of them.
A quick search brings up this link:
https://www.hifiwigwam.com/forum/to...rs-with-matching-xtender-bass-column-plinths/
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Lost in audio
Decameron, would you be able to talk about the Falcons in contrast to the Spendors and Harbeths? How is their bass, for example?
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
The two Spendors and the Harbeth are (for me) sufficiently close in sound to be able to draw general conclusions about them as a group vs the LS3/5a. None of them of course do bass but ‘give an impression’ of bass. The Harbeths might sound a little fuller in the bottom than the either Spendor but the Harbeths are not much different in that respect from the Falcons, though I’d have to listen longer. The thing that struck me immediately was the difference in HF- the Falcons are crisper sounding than the Harbeths.