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Vast Brexit thread merge part VI

The training of most if not all European doctors and nurses is financed by taxpayers in their countries of origin at a very high cost to the treasury.

Shouldn't the UK pay those countries for the privelege of hiring/importing such highly qualified professionals?
Assuming that they still want to come after the Brexit blaze has subsided...
What about the ones training here and leaving? Should the UK be paid for these too? There are more than 500 UK-trained doctors registered in New Zealand alone, most of them practising there, according to this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3265234/

How many must be around the rest of the world?
 
What about the ones training here and leaving? Should the UK be paid for these too? There are more than 500 UK-trained doctors registered in New Zealand alone, most of them practising there, according to this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3265234/

How many must be around the rest of the world?

Aren't UK doctors paying for their training from their own pockets?

The UK doesn't train nurses. Carers, yes, but not nurses.
 
Aren't UK doctors paying for their training from their own pockets?

The UK doesn't train nurses.
Well it trained my missus. She's a nurse, now a newly qualified sonographer, training also paid for by UK, as was her nurse training. And she moved to France as soon as she qualified.
 
What about the ones training here and leaving? Should the UK be paid for these too? There are more than 500 UK-trained doctors registered in New Zealand alone, most of them practising there, according to this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3265234/

How many must be around the rest of the world?
I know a few NHS consultants who said they’d wished they’d taken the opportunity and gone to work in NZ. One is the director of a national strategic service. I’m afraid the way hospital doctors have been treated since 2010 is driving many of them to part time working, gap years and emigration. Do you know how many consultant posts are unfilled in the UK? Tory government Hostile Environment II.
 
Just don't ingest "the news" and stay off the Off Topic forum.

This is a lovely place to be.

My vibes are now really chilled.
 
Well it trained my missus. She's a nurse, now a newly qualified sonographer, training also paid for by UK, as was her nurse training. And she moved to France as soon as she qualified.

According to the EU doctors I know UK nurses have extremely limited competences.
 
bot - farage headlining the bbc all day today. and of course blojo. no real mention of corbyn either. pretty skewed i'd say. or is it me that's biased?
Just audience-seeking. Demagogues make people watch. They either awaken hate in people, or scare them.
 
What about the ones training here and leaving? Should the UK be paid for these too? There are more than 500 UK-trained doctors registered in New Zealand alone, most of them practising there, according to this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3265234/

How many must be around the rest of the world?
I’d like to see a system where doctor training is provided free of charge, with the proviso that doctors commit to say 20 years of working in the NHS.
 
According to the EU doctors I know UK nurses have extremely limited competences.
Ah OK:rolleyes:. So do you mean even after 3 years of university degree training and all the on the job stuff they do (I recall several days a year where she took full days out to be trained on new stuff), they are actually badly trained and the NHS just produces shit nurses? Or do you still really mean the UK does not train nurses and that is why they are no good?

And wtf is an EU doctor anyway?

I'd rewind and start again if I were you. However, I sense that you are not going to get too much grief here, as remainers tend to stick together. You might even get a couple of likes,

Lol
 
I know a few NHS consultants who said they’d wished they’d taken the opportunity and gone to work in NZ. One is the director of a national strategic service. I’m afraid the way hospital doctors have been treated since 2010 is driving many of them to part time working, gap years and emigration. Do you know how many consultant posts are unfilled in the UK? Tory government Hostile Environment II.
Indeed. However, it was also going on before 2010....just not quite as bad. Our lass's biggest regret was voting Tory in 2010. She was fed up of the ongoing cuts, pathetic pay rises and increasing layers of employment rules under Labour. All hell broke loose at Hull Royal in 2007 when they cut the tea bags and instant coffee in the staff canteen.

And you know that training that they never get, well she actually saw the extra pay for it get pulled under Labour. They started tweeking shifts to get out of paying the extra.

If only she could have seen slasher Jeremy Hunt on the horizon.

Anyway, never mind, she left the NHS last month. She was fed up of being seen as incompetent by superior EU doctors.
 
The UK doesn't train nurses. Carers, yes, but not nurses.

According to the EU doctors I know UK nurses have extremely limited competences.

The UK has trained nurses for decades, and continues to do so. These days, they are trained within the university system, rather than in the hospital system. Rather like doctors. They get hands-on experience in the hospitals throughout their training. Rather like doctors.

You can argue, and I wouldn't disagree, that the syllabus and the emphasis on getting a degree, has shifted the balance away from the idea of a 'caring vocation' and towards a 'career', and in doing so has perhaps changed the sort of person who now goes into nursing. And you can argue that perhaps this means that some newly-qualified nurses lack the sort of desirable personal traits that they used to have, before the current system, but it's not correct to say that 'the UK doesn't train nurses' and I'd firmly dispute that their competence is 'extremely limited'.

None of which is meant as an endorsement of the current system, which was a political stunt which appears to have failed. Introduced under Labour, IIRC.
 
The UK has trained nurses for decades, and continues to do so.

The "does not train" was tongue in cheek; it trains but they are under-trained comparatively to Spanish and Portuguese nurses.

Most of our friends are doctors and a few are nurses originally from EU countries. I trust their judgement.

Last year at a thanksgiving lunch an young just-off-the-Uni British nurse agreed with their assessment.


I'm told that at least two of the software packages used in hospitals are hardly fit for purpose (comparatively).


The NHS needs more funding if it's to perform at the level of the best European services. It might not be a bad idea to look at others for guidance/reference either.
In Portugal there's a moderating tax, with the user being charged a small percentage of the cost according to the previous year's tax return (lower tier gets free treatment). The UK though not filthy rich does have very rich people who live here, should the funding come from taxing those fortunes or from the end user?
 
I’d like to see a system where doctor training is provided free of charge, with the proviso that doctors commit to say 20 years of working in the NHS.

This happens in Portugal with Air Force pilots. If the pilot wishes to switch to commercial flying before the end of the grace(?) period then he (or his employer) must pay a hefty charge.
 


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