Who's Heard the Dutch & Dutch Speakers

[zekezebra]

I see there is a very long thread concerning the Kii Three speakers but can find very little, apart from in the dealer section, about the Dutch & Dutch speakers.

A few weeks back I spoke to Martijn Mensink from Dutch & Dutch who offered to deliver and set up a pair for a home demonstration which is fantastic service. I live in Rotterdam where D&D are based.

Has anyone else taken the plunge or had a home demo of these speakers? Of course with a home demo I will make up my own mind but it would be good to hear others experiences with the D&D’s.

Also I cannot get a home demo for the KII Three so it would be great to hear if anyone had the chance to hear these side by side.

Thanks - Paul

 

[Purité Audio]

I have both here, and they ard both superb, Kii probably has the slight edge in ease of use, if you plump for their Kii ‘control’.
You can plug everything into the control , it makes a very neat system.
The 8Cs use an app to set the speakers parameters including volume , but like the Kiis they only have one input ( XLR) which can be either digital or analogue, so if you wanted to connect multiple sources you will need a ‘box’ of some sort to plug everything in to, I use and RME ADI-2 PRO which can send a digital signal to th *cs and attenuate it.
Both speakers are really easy to site within the room, indeed the 8Cs really enjoy being near a rear wall because they utilise the boundary coupling principle.
Ideally you do need to hear both in your room, they are both superb loudspeakers, well systems rather than just loudspeakers.
Keith

 

[AndyU]

If, say, you have your music on a laptop with a USB output and use a player like J River, how would you connect that to the 8cs?

 

[Purité Audio]

You would need a USB to s/pdif/aes converter, you could then attenuate either through the playback software or through the 8Cs own app.
Keith

 

[AndyU]

You would need a USB to s/pdif/aes converter, you could then attenuate either through the playback software or through the 8Cs own app.
Keith

The FAQ says they also have a streaming input. How does that work?

 

[Purité Audio]

Very soon they are going to be ‘roon ready’, when that update is released then you can connect the speakers by RJ45 and you can select them in Roon.
Just the computer running Roon an iPad or phone and the 8Cs.
Keith

 

[Cereal Killer]

And how is the attenuation done, in the digital domain I presume?

 

[Strictly Stereo]

And how is the attenuation done, in the digital domain I presume?

Yes

 

[Purité Audio]

Variable analogue input and properly dithered digital attenuation.
Keith

 

[Cereal Killer]

It can work if done well but facts are digital attenuation is lossy, if the results are audiable is another question

 

[Purité Audio]

Perhaps once, with very poor implementation,
https://www.weiss.ch/assets/content/41/white-paper-on-digital-level-control.pdf

Keith

 

[Strictly Stereo]

It can work if done well but facts are digital attenuation is lossy, if the results are audiable is another question

It works just fine here. It makes much more sense than analogue volume control in a design like this.

 

[Salamander]

I'm shocked to read they only have one input, and the purchase of another box would be needed, if you wanted to use more than one source. I thought the idea of these systems was to reduce box count.

 

[zekezebra]

If I did go for the D&D I would continue to use my Mytek Brooklyn DAC with XLR analogue out to start.

 

[Purité Audio]

That would be fine, I have compared the 8Cs via their digital input, from the RME ADI-Pro and from their analogue input many times and I can’t hear a difference.
Martijn said they spent a great deal of time ensuring the A/D was completely transparent.
I believe Dutch&Dutch are working on their own ‘break out’ box similar to the `Kii ‘control’, but simpler as the 8Cs parameters are set by app, just input selection, volume and mute.
Keith

 

[Cereal Killer]

I must admit the D&D look much much more appealing than the Kii's ..... Shame they need what is in all intents and purposes a pre-amp to select various inputs.

 

[AndyU]

It works just fine here. It makes much more sense than analogue volume control in a design like this.

Hw do you get a digital signal to them, and control the volume?

 

[Cereal Killer]

It works just fine here. It makes much more sense than analogue volume control in a design like this.

Understood that entire system is digital till the cones so yes i see this too. How is the dithering handled, which processor is being used and how many bits does it use to mask the lossy attenuation.... and at what db does the processor actually start chopping bits off?

 

[Purité Audio]

Hw do you get a digital signal to them, and control the volume?

The 8Cs have their own app ‘lanspeaker.com’ you set all of the speakers parameters through that, distance to the rear and side wall, tone, 24 EQ filters , gain ,input latency and volume.
You can choose and switch between digital and analogue input, just connect your streamer to them ,use the attenuator on the playback software or the speakers own attenuator, a small inexpensive break out box such as the Grimm LS1 would be useful for listeners with multiple sources, I don’t know how far away that is from release though. I use the RME box which can send a digital signal to the speakers and attenuate.
Keith

 

[Strictly Stereo]

I'm shocked to read they only have one input, and the purchase of another box would be needed, if you wanted to use more than one source. I thought the idea of these systems was to reduce box count.

You’re shocked by this? This aspect of the design is shared with pretty much every other pair of active or passive speakers ever made.

The have built in volume control, so some customers can already manage without a preamp.

Each 8c also has an Ethernet connection. Pretty soon you will be able to connect that directly to Roon.