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MDAC First Listen (part 00101000)

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Fusion reference / fusion statement?

Great to hear about the progress John. I know China is not everyone's cup of tea but if I were you I'd be diving in head first, it's a wonderful interesting culture and it'd be a shame to feel you missed out on anything due to a feeling of reservation in any way. Go for it mate :)
 
If the trip goes well, then I can post renderings of the Full width DAC (It looks likes it will be called the Fusion DAC, as its a Fusion of miniDSP and my DAC / Analogue design skills and IP ) :) also, the VFET amp :)
Sorry if I have misunderstood, but is the position now that one will need the full width case to take advantage of the miniDSP feature?
 
Hi John,

Or should we call you Indian Jones from now on:). It's all sounding very exciting from this end. It's great to hear the MiniDSP talks went so well. Let's hope you come back with the prize on Friday Dr. Jones and throw back a large whiskey in HK.:)
 
Sprint,

Can I ask why you prefer the MDAC chassis - is it due to its size, or the extra cost of the Full width chassis?

Hi John

Several reasons. Size is a factor, for me, as a FWC will be a bit difficult to install in my current set up and I am also reluctant at the extra costs involved unless there are significant benefits in terms of SQ or other factors?

This whole project, again for me, revolves around improved SQ and to a lesser degree improved/additional functionality but as it stands the only reason, at this moment in time as I am not interested in a CD slot, to go for a FWC would be for the proposed HQ PS?

From your own previous posts the addition of a HQ PS would only have gone ahead if you were happy/convinced that it provided a worthwhile improvement over the standard existing PS. However, it now seems that the FWC option is going ahead and including a HQ PS, which for many people may be the only reason they would go that route, that as far as I am aware has neither been built and tested to show/prove that it does or will provide any significant benefit in terms of SQ, which was your original objective?

So, at this moment I am hesitant to go the FWC route that will include a HQ PS that has not been shown/proved to provide any real SQ benefit.

Andy
 
M-DAC and Squeezebox Touch, what’s the best method to connect? I’ve always assumed (pretty sure I’ve read it in several places too) that USB is best as it is asynchronous and clock locked but is it really the best? I’m getting a bit frustrated as I seem to be having handshake issues between the two so am open to trying the other digital connections, of course I’ll listen for myself but what are others thoughts on this?

Thanks.
 
M-DAC and Squeezebox Touch, what’s the best method to connect? I’ve always assumed (pretty sure I’ve read it in several places too) that USB is best as it is asynchronous and clock locked but is it really the best? I’m getting a bit frustrated as I seem to be having handshake issues between the two so am open to trying the other digital connections, of course I’ll listen for myself but what are others thoughts on this?

Thanks.

Consensus is that USB is best due to reduced chanced of jitter, however my experience has been that I can't tell between them so I wouldn't worry too much.
 
Thanks Sibbers. I might try a powered hub as I use the work around currently and that may not help issues. I'm not sure if it is they way the two are interacting or the Touch, it didn't happen before I got the M-DAC though. Almost every time I want a listening session I have to spend five minutes re-doing my settings.
 
Apart from not having access to the Internet in the apartment in one of the worlds most connected cites - its been a very successfull trip.

The team at miniDSP are really wonderful and creative - I see a very successful future with a Fusion of our skill sets.

Tomorrow I cross the board into China to meet the CNC vendor - I worry about there set-up, I suspect they are just a trader rather then the direct factory contact. If this proves to be correct, then I have other options but I'd rather not need to divert my attention to much.

I'm not looking forward to the trip into China, I don't have anyone local to fall back on if something happens - I'm on my own on this one! Maybe I've just got used to the security and safety of may lab in Czech - China is a rather drastic contrast.

Will stay over night in China - hopefully back into HK on Friday :)

If the trip goes well, then I can post renderings of the Full width DAC (It looks likes it will be called the Fusion DAC, as its a Fusion of miniDSP and my DAC / Analogue design skills and IP ) :) also, the VFET amp :)

Off topic rather, but I remember taking a day trip into China from HK a couple of years before the handover. On the way back I found myself alone in the border control area with an entry form to fill in, no pen, and only a scowling Chinese lady guard in uniform toting a gun almost as large as she was. There was I, making sign language to borrow a pen from her. I succeeded but she watched that official biro like a hawk and made it clear I wasn't going to walk off with it at my peril! All in all I was mightily relieved to step back on to what was then British soil:D
 
If its your adapter that's been damaged, then I'll sort you out a replacement once I return from HK on around the 15th.

Thanks John. That's very generous of you. I am sure we can work out appropriate payment in hard currency or suitable drink of your choice :)

Glad to hear the trip is going well so far. I hope the China trip also works out.
 
M-DAC and Squeezebox Touch, what’s the best method to connect? I’ve always assumed (pretty sure I’ve read it in several places too) that USB is best as it is asynchronous and clock locked but is it really the best? I’m getting a bit frustrated as I seem to be having handshake issues between the two so am open to trying the other digital connections, of course I’ll listen for myself but what are others thoughts on this?

Thanks.
I personally use toslink to connect my sbt, since it provides complete electrical isolation. I would not assume that there is necessarily any actual advantage in USB since the Asrc in the ess chip will attenuate jitter dramatically and the hard evidence of jitter audibility is thin on the ground. No sooner had asych USB been widely adopted than lots of hand waving about galvanic isolation became the vogue.
Unless you feel you can hear a big difference I wouldn't worry about it
 
M-DAC and Squeezebox Touch, what’s the best method to connect? I’ve always assumed (pretty sure I’ve read it in several places too) that USB is best as it is asynchronous and clock locked but is it really the best? I’m getting a bit frustrated as I seem to be having handshake issues between the two so am open to trying the other digital connections, of course I’ll listen for myself but what are others thoughts on this?

For what it's worth I've found that USB is best for feeding the M-DAC from a PC. Have tried optical and coax. I expected the optical to be better given the electrical isolation but it was probably the worst of the three with the effect of the USB to be delivering more detail to the sound. I relegated the optical feed as taking the input from a TV set top box which I was very keen to keep electrically isolated from everything else. However, the coax feed from a friend's squeezebox touch appeared to do fine.

--

Doug
 
Seems all good news Mr Westlake, except for the Case Vendor. Glad to hear you are ok, but do you mean China is dangerous, risky place to traverse! Maybe there are places in India that might cost a little bit more, but safer? We don't want anything happening to you now!!!

China can be dangerous, it depends where you are. Beijing is quite safe, somewhere like Dongguan, big manufacturing centre that has the type of companies John is looking for, less so. The big problem is getting them to do what has been asked, without the backup of a big company would be hard work.
 
Hi everyone and JohnW :)
I am going to buy a DAC for my sound system and after looking around on the internet and all the possibilities provided by this product, I am going to buy a second hand M-DAC!

I guess that will be a good step from the current AV Emotiva UMC200 preamp/processor that I am using for my music.

The thing that intrigues me a lot is that it seems there are a lot of mods currently available and maybe even more available in the future.

The question now is: will it be possible to apply the mods you are talking about on a standard M-DAC or do I have to buy a specific one to be able to apply the mods in the future?
At the moment the idea is to invest on buying the M-DAC and then spend the future investments on the mods, but I need to make sure any M-DAC can work for this.

It should get along well with my system I hope, the amplifier is an old NAD319 completely refurbished few months ago with the power stage upgraded too by an ex Musical Fidelity engineer and a pair of Focal 816W.

Please guide me through this, I am new on this M-DAC thing and I want to know more without getting confused by thousands of different sites and opinions :D This seems to be the best place with JohnW being the designer of the product!

Alex
 
Hi everyone and JohnW :)
I am going to buy a DAC for my sound system and after looking around on the internet and all the possibilities provided by this product, I am going to buy a second hand M-DAC!

I guess that will be a good step from the current AV Emotiva UMC200 preamp/processor that I am using for my music.

The thing that intrigues me a lot is that it seems there are a lot of mods currently available and maybe even more available in the future.

The question now is: will it be possible to apply the mods you are talking about on a standard M-DAC or do I have to buy a specific one to be able to apply the mods in the future?
At the moment the idea is to invest on buying the M-DAC and then spend the future investments on the mods, but I need to make sure any M-DAC can work for this.

It should get along well with my system I hope, the amplifier is an old NAD319 completely refurbished few months ago with the power stage upgraded too by an ex Musical Fidelity engineer and a pair of Focal 816W.

Please guide me through this, I am new on this M-DAC thing and I want to know more without getting confused by thousands of different sites and opinions :D This seems to be the best place with JohnW being the designer of the product!

Alex



If I was you, I would get my name down for an M-Dac2 with full width case.. Then there is no need to purchase a second hand M-dac, and gives you all the options.
JohnW is talking of having availability by Christmas, but do take that with a pinch of salt...
 
Hey Alex, there is a chap selling his MDAC and his contributions this far to the MDAC2 which can might interest you? Take a look in the classifieds section.

I understand that John wanted to stop modifying MDACs in favour of creating a statement DAC from the ground up in order to achieve what those who wanted more from the MDAC wanted. In this regard, buying an MDAC wouldn't get you any further than getting an MDAC (which is by anyone's standards, a very competent bit of equipment). You may be able to get on the project but it would cost the MDAC plus the dev fees and then the unit at cost providing you're not too late. You might be in afraid as John is in China and asked for final numbers prior to leaving.

Otherwise, you could just buy the MDAC2 when it's done.

I think they are your options.
 
Thanks for the replies guys!
So if I understood correctly MDAC2 will be a full size redesigned product... There is not plan to proceed on the original MDAC improvements I guess?

If I was you, I would get my name down for an M-Dac2 with full width case..
It would be the best thing, correct. But it depends mainly on the target price we are talking about. The MDAC idea was to get the upgrades in stages and not get killed by my girlfriend that is already complaining I am spending too much on "this stuff" :D

Hey Alex, there is a chap selling his MDAC and his contributions this far to the MDAC2 which can might interest you? Take a look in the classifieds section.
That is quite interesting! A little bit more that the budget I had in mind and he doesn't say where the item is, but interesting.

Consider that I would get my original MDAC for £340 though, which seems a fair price. That would still leave £260 for improvements before getting to the £600 requested. Would £260 be too short for the improvements?

I am so confused, sorry guys :D :D
It is just that I started looking at the Audiolab 8200DQ, then read reviews saying that the M-DAC is still superior, so for £350 it was a no brainer, then the mods available, new power supply available, so even more looking forward to it, and now a little bit nervous if a new version comes out in few months, but I don't know the price :D
 
Thanks for the replies guys!
So if I understood correctly MDAC2 will be a full size redesigned product... There is not plan to proceed on the original MDAC improvements I guess?

Unless I've missed something, there will be two versions of the MDAC2.

The first will be a replacement board for the one in the existing MDAC case.

The second will be a new full sized chassis using the same (or similar) board with an on-board power supply (i.e. not a separate brick like the current MDAC).
 
Unless I've missed something, there will be two versions of the MDAC2.

The first will be a replacement board for the one in the existing MDAC case.

The second will be a new full sized chassis using the same (or similar) board with an on-board power supply (i.e. not a separate brick like the current MDAC).

If confirmed, that would be absolutely BRILLIANT!
I could use the MDAC as standard for few months, paied £340 which is not bad, and then when I got enough brownie points I can spend the next batch to get the new board to be installed...

And the new PSU as well :D so many things, I love this thing, I can upgrade it in at least 3 stages if that is the case, and I won't have to be single! :D :D
 
Only hurdle is I'm not sure John is taking on the upgrades for the original MDAC, unless you are suggesting doing it yourself? Looks tricky though, with multilayer PCB etc.
 
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