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Which caps to replace in a Naim 62

Discussion in 'd.i.y.' started by RobD, Dec 17, 2008.

  1. RobD

    RobD Active Member

    Hi,

    I would like to improve the sound of my Naim 62, but I want to start with some easy changes. I would replace the feedback and power-rail decoupling capacitors on the moving coil boards, but I am unable to decide which is which. Should I replace the two other Roe caps on the main board, and if so, with what?
    Can anyone help, or let me know of a good web-site, with pictures of the 62 (not a 72), please?
    I tried Neil McBride's and Acoustica.

    Thanks,
    RD.
     
  2. neiljadman

    neiljadman Senior Member

    Rob for the simple main board mods see: NAC62 Cap Changes.

    You can also bypass the balance pot if you don't need it: Balance pot bypass

    I've got some pix of he 323 boards somewhere too. I'll post them later.
     
  3. neiljadman

    neiljadman Senior Member

  4. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    i'd start by trying a wima mks2 22uf in the 323 feedback cap, listen for a few days. then an oscon 56uf in the pwrail decoupling: evaluate these properly 1st -then- proceed, perhaps looking twds the same caps on the gain boards.

    nb if you like the naim grunt, dont use the silmic2 47uf (anywhere but in the river imo) in the gain feedback poition: this very cap is most important to the whole nac preamp sound.
     
  5. YNWOAN

    YNWOAN 100% Analogue

    Captain, I'm surprised you feel quite so strongly with regard to the use of Silmic II.
     
  6. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    its just.. A) they were the 'thing' to use, according to acoustica.. but that was then, ages ago: there are loads of better proven caps now.

    and (why it hits a chord with me).. B) it fundamentally changes a naim nac, to well, any old (vg) detail-laden-yet-the-naim'thing'-gone preamp, ie from punchy fun sound to soft mushy, and very very girly sound.
     
  7. Harthold

    Harthold pfm Member

    If recreating the live music experience is what you think hifi should be about then you cannot be entirely against Silmic II. If you think live music is only metaphoricaly related to what we want in our living room then you can dispense with "mushy" girly" stuff.
    Cheers
     
  8. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    i completely/ comprehensively disagree: live sound, to me is often gritty, a bit harsh, energy, fast & fun.. which is EXACTLY why naim hooked me (& why its inherrant sound should be preserved-or its not a naim Imo anymore).. live sound is completely NOT soft, girly, warm n fuzzy:).. another eg (and a generalisation, but nertheless); valve hifi amps may sound extremely sweet and enticing, but they simply do not capture the direct essence of live sound.
     
  9. neiljadman

    neiljadman Senior Member

    I know you feel strongly about this Rory, but you are the only person I have noted who feels this way. Most people seem to prefer it there - especially over the Wima MKS2-XL. 22uF or 10.

    And I don't know if it is any different, but I'm using the original Elna Silmic - i.e., not the II version.
     
  10. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    i have a good few silmicII 47uf's in my 32.5, in fact- they are indeed excellent on ALWSR's..

    but absolutlely not in the gain board feedback. Just goes from naim.. to not-naim mushy detailed preamp-thing, at the change of 1 cap.

    Thats my point. Carl would agree, for one.
     
  11. bivalve

    bivalve pfm Member

    I agree with the Captain. Silmics were left behind a couple of years ago in favour of NOS Roedersteins and MMKs. I havn't tried a single MKS2-Xl because I use 5 (five) of the 10uF caps in parallel on a piece of stripboard superglued to each 321. They walk all over a Silmic II or NOS Roederstein. Never heard a MMK.


    Bass is tight and deep but I really love the transparency and unfatiguing sweetness c.f. the others. But consider, there are some guys listening to (huge) polypropylene and paper-in-oil feedback caps.

    Neil,

    your original Silmics are possibly better as they have a larger can size as I recollect. There are compromises in reducing can size.


    David
     
  12. yairf

    yairf pfm Member

    My experiance with the 62:
    - For signal path, I usually vote for Mil-Spec tants.
    - use 22uF instead of 47uF in feedback loop, while the resistor reduced from 12K to 6.2K (3dB less gain and more volume knob travel).
    - Increase cut-off frequency in the buffer stage input.
    - add as many Teddy-regs as you possibly can...
    Cheers,
    Yair
     
  13. neiljadman

    neiljadman Senior Member

    Food for thought and a test over the holiday - maybe even 2 22s and a 3.3..mmmmmm....
     
  14. Harthold

    Harthold pfm Member

    MMK (EVOX RIFA)sound great to me as feedback caps in Power Amps (110, 250), unbeatable I guess, but I do prefer something to balance on the 321. Perhaps we should keep trying longer.
     
  15. The Captain

    The Captain ~~~~~~~~~~

    i have 22uf wimas as feedback in my nap 140, but soon Illl put back MMK 47uf monsters: these are the best Ive tried here so far. Preamp 321 feedbacks I resolutely stick to NOS Roe's- altho not nearly as detailed as the lots of others Ive tried, its just naim naim naim.

    I tend to use 10uf film caps for 321 inputs, tants for other board inputs.. and silmicII (10 uf- these are vg) for all board outputs. Oscon 56uf for 321 PwrRail. Ive arrived here after -loads- of cap combination tests.
     
  16. neiljadman

    neiljadman Senior Member

    So Rob,

    it all goes to show that it's a lot of trial and error and personal taste involved- lot's of advice and options - but no short cut to sonic nirvana!

    Just try them until you find what you like!
     
  17. hacker

    hacker Delicious and nutritious

    Yup, I agree with The Captain - mushy and dull. I used to think they were great until I started trying other caps... I don't think I'd go back to them now. In a 140 they were even worse!
     
  18. Jo Sharp

    Jo Sharp Pulls on doors marked push

    My Silmics have now been consigned to the spare parts bin for a long time. They messed things up in both coupling and feedback positions when I tried them over several weeks.

    Jo

    PS.. I still have a few NOS Roederstein 47uFs left over to sell ( those to whom I owe favours get priority). PM me.
     
  19. RobD

    RobD Active Member

    Hi Neil,
    that was just what I needed.
    Many thanks,
    Rob.
     
  20. RobD

    RobD Active Member

    Hi everyone,
    Thank you very much for your help. It is less cut and dried than I originally thought, but that makes it more interesting.

    ta,
    Rob.
     

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