Arkless Electronics
Trade: Amp design and repairs.
Joe, Should there be no ideal of truthfulness to the sound of live music to which we should hopefully be striving? If not then what is the point of it all!?
What's all the aggression about in the audio room?
- Thread starter Cereal Killer
- Start date
Teddy Ray
pfm Member
now youve gone and got personal. im vexed, terribly. ;-)
Joe P
Memory Alpha incarnate | mod; Shatner number = 2
Jez,
Anyone with woofers smaller than 15 inches sitting in a big box is fooling himself into believing he has real bass with headroom.* Do these poor deluded fools recognize they're deluded (and have shit bass) or shall we educate them to the folly of their foo ways?
Mr. P
* It's a scientific fact. A well-respected audiophile on the UK's most respected forum said so. Linky.
Anyone with woofers smaller than 15 inches sitting in a big box is fooling himself into believing he has real bass with headroom.* Do these poor deluded fools recognize they're deluded (and have shit bass) or shall we educate them to the folly of their foo ways?
Mr. P
* It's a scientific fact. A well-respected audiophile on the UK's most respected forum said so. Linky.
Arkless Electronics
Trade: Amp design and repairs.
That ain't foo... merely economy of scale for a domestic setting...
I'm merely trying to point out the bloody obvious which is that "Hi-Fi" is something that can be defined... I seem to remember Quad calling it "the closest approach to the original sound"... works for me!
We won't always achieve it but at least it is surely a definable goal?
Joe P
Memory Alpha incarnate | mod; Shatner number = 2
Jez,
Bloke A loves the midrange clarity of his Quad 57s, yet may be oblivious to the speaker's shortcomings (restricted volume, lack of deep bass, extreme directionality, etc.).
Bloke B loves the deep bass and headroom of monstrous JBLs, yet may be oblivious to the speaker's shortcomings (bass bloom, colouration, etc.).
Who has the more accurate speaker, assuming a wide range of music? If you're a Bach organ freak Quads ain't gonna cut it. And if you like string quartets the JBL's colouration might drive you bonkers.
Joe
But that's my point. It's not definable because all systems fall short of the ideal.
Bloke A loves the midrange clarity of his Quad 57s, yet may be oblivious to the speaker's shortcomings (restricted volume, lack of deep bass, extreme directionality, etc.).
Bloke B loves the deep bass and headroom of monstrous JBLs, yet may be oblivious to the speaker's shortcomings (bass bloom, colouration, etc.).
Who has the more accurate speaker, assuming a wide range of music? If you're a Bach organ freak Quads ain't gonna cut it. And if you like string quartets the JBL's colouration might drive you bonkers.
Joe
You should always be nice to your mother no matter what!
Teddy Ray
pfm Member
erm. you get the speaker that has the least shortcomings in both areas..
Space is the Place
pfm Member
PsB
Citizen of Nowhere™
[Relentless Objectivist Mode on] "Ah, but Joe, the speaker doesn't know whether it's playing Bach organ toccatas or Haydn string quartets, don't you see? It's a machine!!!" [Relentless Objectivist Mode off]
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
Greg,
You could do some research. If you did that, you'd find that ATC have introduced the 34 mm version of their tweeter, as fitted to the 300, and are still working on the 25 mm version, as fitted to the smaller models.
S-Man
StrivingON
I've only got 3 X 8" inch bass units per side. Measurements show they are -3dB at 20 Hz (or whatever I set them to) and have almost ideal transient response (way better than ported or transmission line speakers and better than a sealed box).
Am I fooling myself that they are capable of producing real bass?
john & Jake
Jake was smarter than me
Hi, my tuppence,
I dont read all threads and I don't know which threads are aggressive, but one thing I have found with hi fi that polarises people when it shouldn't is......
The realisation that striving for realistic sounding hifi in the home is impossible.
Once this is realised then you can make your system sound good and to your taste. When it is you will be happy just as joe bloggs will be happy with his.
When we are all happy that our systems must sound different but we like it perhaps wars may end and we'll comment on the music we listened to last night.
I dont read all threads and I don't know which threads are aggressive, but one thing I have found with hi fi that polarises people when it shouldn't is......
The realisation that striving for realistic sounding hifi in the home is impossible.
Once this is realised then you can make your system sound good and to your taste. When it is you will be happy just as joe bloggs will be happy with his.
When we are all happy that our systems must sound different but we like it perhaps wars may end and we'll comment on the music we listened to last night.
bob atherton
pfm Member
Yes, a definable goal if the goal is to achieve a sort of perfect DNA match to the original performance or studio master.
For me and my wife this is not what we are after in our sitting room. FWIW I am a gigging bass player with plenty of studio and stage experience.
I have, Markus,especially, with regard to the development of the 50 and 100 actives which is why I asked if there had been a development that I was unaware of with regard to these flagship models.
Spacey enquired aeons ago on the ATC Forum concerning the new tweeter on these 2 products, whilst he still had his 50 actives, and to my knowledge has never received a response.
It does seem strange IMO that these 2 products still await such development with years passing by, especially, when the present tweeter is considered a relative weakness in the context of the speaker as a whole.
To add to the matter, my understanding, and I stand to be corrected, is that the reason why the new tweeter has not yet cascaded down to the 100 and 50 actives as one might have expected by now, is because ATC are still attempting to fit a new tweeter in these relatively smaller speakers ( can't imagine many terraced houses in the UK accommodating the 300! ) that is retrofittable for those with exisitng products.
ATC are an astonishing company and, as you know, don't change their products for the sake of it and don't update existing products without being sure the same is sound, in every sense of the word, which makes me wonder, as I mentioned earlier on the thread, whether their Cd player/DAC/Pre has possibly been the subject of further redevelopment as it no longer appears to be on their site.
Regards,
Greg
Cereal Killer
432
Greg, the CDP/DAC/Pre thingy been out since Jan. They just don't shout about it; leaving that to the salesman and retailers i suppose.
With regards to the new 25mm HF unit, Bob Polley tells me they're working on the production, the design is complete. So expect to see it very soon
With regards to the new 25mm HF unit, Bob Polley tells me they're working on the production, the design is complete. So expect to see it very soon
darrylfunk
Banned
Greg, the CDP/DAC/Pre thingy been out since Jan. They just don't shout about it; leaving that to the salesman and retailers i suppose.
With regards to the new 25mm HF unit, Bob Polley tells me they're working on the production, the design is complete. So expect to see it very soon
they need someone like that fellow from that avi lot - he spams everyone before the product even has a proper r&d model....