advertisement


Water Divining

sq225917 said:
I believe in science, and all physical science can be reduced to quantum mechaincs if you want to. But all the evidence, except your reference points to birds navigating via magnetic field, and last time I checked magnetic fields are part of the invisible spectrum, even to birds.
Click to expand...
The latest research indicates that both you and firemoon are right (or wrong):

http://hore.chem.ox.ac.uk/PDFs/The_Quantum_Robin.pdf

See especially the section headed "Cryptochrome".

The possibility that birds’ magnetic compasses might be based on a light-induced chemical reaction in the eye was suggested by Klaus Schulten, now at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, in a far-sighted paper at a time (1978) when the radical pair mechanism was in its infancy. Only later, did Wolfgang and Roswitha Wiltschko, working at the University of Frankfurt discover that, as Schulten had anticipated, birds need (blue or green) light for their compass to work.
Click to expand...
 
sq225917 said:
I believe in science, and all physical science can be reduced to quantum mechaincs if you want to. But all the evidence, except your reference points to birds navigating via magnetic field, and last time I checked magnetic fields are part of the invisible spectrum, even to birds.
Click to expand...

I read somewhere that birds and fish are able to detect magnetic fields by means of ferrous particles in their inner ear (or somewhere), and were able to navigate long distances using using this capacity together with observing the position of the sun with reference to an internal clock.

I thing reference to quantum mechanics in this context is just spin.
 
When I was around thirty years old I worked as a gardener for a County Council. They ran courses on gardening techniques and one day eleven of us were in a classroom to be shown dowsing. The teacher put a clay tile (a one foot piece of pipe used in drainage) on the floor, put carpet over it so it could not be seen, and asked us to walk over it whilst holding two 'L' shaped rods. In one hand we held a small piece of a similar pipe - this was to make us think 'pipe'. For eight of us, including me, the rods crossed as we walked over the pipe. I felt nothing - they just crossed. I agree this was a very artificial situation but I have no explanation as to why it happened. An amazing experience.

I've tried to repeat this in a field where I knew pipes existed but never managed to get it to work. It may be I was concentrating too much. I think it's a bit like trying to remember something - if you concentrate too hard you can't remember, but relax or be diverted for a while and the memory often returns.

As mentioned above, the rods - or spinning stone, or 'Y' shaped wood - are just an indicator and it is your body that does the detection.

I read a book on it once and there was a story about two men lost in a car on a cold winters day in the U.S.. They just disappeared and no-one knew what happened. In desperation they got a dowser in and he used a spinning weight over a map of the area. This indicated a point on the map but it was initially dismissed because it was over a lake. Eventually they did go in a boat and had a look. The car and bodies were there. It was realised that the lake was frozen at the time and the men must have driven out on the lake and the ice had broke. It's a good story anyway.
 
I can get it to work, not always reliable but generally I can pin-point the line of pipes and cables. I only use bits of wire from old coat hangers, perhaps I need an upgrade?
 
With a mate - at least as sceptical as I - many years ago, and, erm after a few ciders for muscular relaxation, accurately mapped every little feature of his rather large garden late one night using bent welding rods (held in glass beer bottles duct-tapped carefully orthogonally in two axes to a long spirit level to counter biases etc).

We couldn't help it, we bumped into everything: confirmation bias no doubt.
Dowsing does make you feel rotten the following day, was the lesson.
 
martin clark said:
With a mate - at least as sceptical as I - many years ago, and, erm after a few ciders for muscular relaxation, accurately mapped every little feature of his rather large garden late one night using bent welding rods (held in glass beer bottles duct-tapped carefully orthogonally in two axes to a long spirit level to counter biases etc).

We couldn't help it, we bumped into everything: confirmation bias no doubt.
Dowsing does make you feel rotten the following day, was the lesson.
Click to expand...

My understanding is that the wires would cross, or the twig bend, due to involuntary small muscle movements of the dowser. So by taking care to ensure that such muscle movements can't happen, or would be spotted if they happen, you effectively invalidate the test.

That and the ciders, which are not known for their role in rigorous scientific endeavour, obvs. ;)
 
The problem is with the description..."Divining" which is a foo word, like soothsaying or foretelling. I hadn't "divined" your intentions...I hadn't guessed, anticipated, read your mind etc.
If it was a truly scientific method it would be called "detection". Thus, I have a water detector. Then you would at least expect it to actually work. If you need to give it a margin of error then it is not scientific...its just a cop out.
 
madmike said:
The problem is with the description..."Divining" which is a foo word, like soothsaying or foretelling. I hadn't "divined" your intentions...I hadn't guessed, anticipated, read your mind etc.
If it was a truly scientific method it would be called "detection". Thus, I have a water detector. Then you would at least expect it to actually work. If you need to give it a margin of error then it is not scientific...its just a cop out.
Click to expand...

truly scientific like a Lie "Detector" you mean?
 
Well, the wrong word in that description is "Lie"...should be called a fluctuation in heart rate detector which is of course scientific. Whether your heart rate actually fluctuates when you lie is another matter .
 
My brother in-law works for ODI (Overseas Development Institute), specifically in the field of finding and supplying water to third world countries. along with lots of modern technology they still occasionally use water diviners!
 
Dig a bore hole deep enough anywhere and you will find water...
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.


advertisement


Back
Top