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Ribbon Tweeters

richardg

richardg

Admonishtrator
I've just got for the 2nd time in my life a pair of speakers with ribbon tweeters - in the form of a pair of Adams.

They are again as I remembered the first pair: detailed, flat dry, perfect. Overall, this new pair is not as good, the other pair were three way and this pair is 2 way.

Is anyone else a fan of ribbon tweeters? And what (not expensive) speakers are out there that are worth considering?
 
I love ribbon tweeters and Adams, one of my dream speakers are the S5's. You are correct about 2 vs 3 way. In every 2 way Adam I have heard the ribbon is so quick and transparent that makes the woofer look slow, it can't follow and I can hear a "hole" in the middle. The mid dome solves that and makes the transition as it should be.

I've seen more companies using ribbon tweeters the last few years but I don't remember anyone making affordable speakers. For example, I like the sound of the Proac but they are overpriced, IMO. For the price I of a K6 pair I can buy a pair of S5's that include 2200 watt of mono amps and have significant change.
 
Adam speakers don’t actually use ribbon tweeters, they are AMT (Air Motion Transformer) designs.
 
Kostas said:
I love ribbon tweeters and Adams, one of my dream speakers are the S5's. You are correct about 2 vs 3 way. In every 2 way Adam I have heard the ribbon is so quick and transparent that makes the woofer look slow, it can't follow and I can hear a "hole" in the middle. The mid dome solves that and makes the transition as it should be.

I've seen more companies using ribbon tweeters the last few years but I don't remember anyone making affordable speakers. For example, I like the sound of the Proac but they are overpriced, IMO. For the price I of a K6 pair I can buy a pair of S5's that include 2200 watt of mono amps and have significant change.
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Right, that is exactly as I hear it. The S3V is what I want really, but cannot afford them. The pair they replaced are about 2 grand a pair second hand.
 
My Monitor Audio GX 100s have ribbon tweeters. I think they are great for the price and not too difficult to drive.

Pretty transparent, detailed with an engaging articulate sound. These characteristics became even more apparent after upgrading their internal wiring and replacing the damping foam with wool.


Adding a couple of REL R528 SE subwoofers I get a full range setup that I truly enjoy.
 
They do actually work in a quite different way - but I won’t bore you with it. All the drivers with the yellow pleating look are actually AMT’s though even manufacturers sometimes call them ribbons.

AMT have slightly higher moving mass than a true ribbon but couple to air better and can be crossed over at a lower frequency. The negative for both designs is that they are so ‘fast’ sounding that when used in a two way design they often sound quite different in terms of character than the mid/bass driver (as said in a post above).
 
radamel said:
My Monitor Audio GX 100s have ribbon tweeters. I think they are great for the price and not too difficult to drive.

Pretty transparent, detailed with an engaging articulate sound. These characteristics became even more apparent after upgrading their internal wiring and replacing the damping foam with wool.


Adding a couple of REL R528 SE subwoofers I get a full range setup that I truly enjoy.
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And not wishing they were 3-way?
 
YNWOAN said:
Adam speakers don’t actually use ribbon tweeters, they are AMT (Air Motion Transformer) designs.
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You are correct. My experience has been with various Adams over the years. First one I ever heard (years ago) was the Compact (MK I) with a huge valve Audio Research power amp and a valve preamp that I can't remember. It was the warmest Adam I have ever heard by far but it was loosing in clarity compared to the biggest 3 way ICE powered speakers.

I have also auditioned the 2 way SLS HT8R, I don't know if it had a ribbon or AMT. The highs were impressive, very airy and detailed but again it needed a mid dome.
 
If their limitations are not an issue there are no better tweeters in my opinion. I'm on my third pair of ribbons and can't see myself using others. Rare to find them in budget speakers. The cheapest I know of is Dayton Audio B-652 Air.
 
richgilb said:
And not wishing they were 3-way?
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Not at all.

I had the chance to compare these GX100 plus a single REL R528 SE to a pair of GX300 (their big 3 way sisters) and I clearly preferred the former.

Such a setup is easier to drive and more flexible in terms of placing and adjustments (xover and gain).

Adding a second subwoofer it gets even better. :)
 
Probably the upgrade I eventually will be the ADAM S3XV. I see them go used for 2 grand....getting a pair of amps thrown in for the price only makes them about twice what I can afford!
 
The Quad S series have ribbon tweeters. I haven't heard them, and while some might not consider £500+ speakers to be "budget" offerings, they're not exactly bank busters either.
 
I accept the subjective comments about the "fast" sound of ribbon tweeters, but what parameter demonstrates this?
A decent soft dome can reach >>20KHz and it has to move sufficiently fast to be able to do that. Do things really sound fast if they can go faster/higher than this?

Some damning comments on ribbons here:
http://www.zaphaudio.com/nondomes/

Does the "fast" sound come from distortion?

OTOH these have amazing specs (at a significant price point):
http://www.raalribbon.com/download/raal_140-15d.pdf
 
YNWOAN said:
They do actually work in a quite different way - but I won’t bore you with it. All the drivers with the yellow pleating look are actually AMT’s though even manufacturers sometimes call them ribbons.

AMT have slightly higher moving mass than a true ribbon but couple to air better and can be crossed over at a lower frequency. The negative for both designs is that they are so ‘fast’ sounding that when used in a two way design they often sound quite different in terms of character than the mid/bass driver (as said in a post above).
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I have a pair of IPL S5TL Mk2s, built from a kit...

http://iplacoustics.co.uk/S5tl Kevlar 2.htm

...these are the tweeters

http://loudspeakerfreaks.com/Product.asp?mfr=HiVi Research&part=RT1.3M&Product_ID=8391

...they're advertised as 'Isodynamic Ribbon Tweeters', but definitely have a 'yellow pleating look', so are they actually AMTs?
 
I had a pair of Adam S2v for a short while.... luckily I bought them from a pro audio shop who were easy about sale or return. The treble sounded like it was coming from a completely different speaker than the bass, just didn't match at all.

Previous experience of ribbon tweeters was on Dali Helicon 400, where the treble duties were shared between a normal silk dome and a ribbon and that seemed to work very nicely.
 
Yup they're AMTs.

I have a set of RAAL 140-15D that replace the tweeters on my ns1000m, I wouldn't swap them back.

S-Man, maybe the fast sound does come from a distortion in some ribbons, or maybe it comes from a better impulse response, narrower Q or a myriad of other possibilities. I don't think my RAALS sound fast in the way I've heard some ribbons and AMTs, I just like the way they couple to the room.
 
Lol, that's a nice selection of poorly engineered far east ribbons that Zaph picks to support his world view. Shame he didn't try RAALs or the Mundorf AMTs.
 
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