Naim

[Beobloke]

Also, I am still highly offended by any company which releases a product which is supposed to be 'high quality', only to then tell customers that it really needs a Power Supply upgrade, which comprises a pretty basic toroidal transformer and a few bits, in a box.. a 'snip' at a couple of grand. Piss taking of the highest order.

It may surprise you to learn that you don’t actually have to buy one of these power supplies. Your amp will not stop working if you don’t, nor is there a trained team of Naim ‘heavies’ who will re-arrange your kneecaps if you fail to grab a Hi-Cap within an undefined period.

 

[Witchfinder-general]

I'm currently selling my Naim system, looking around I don't see that other high end hifi brands are that much cheaper.

 

[Mullardman]

It may surprise you to learn that you don’t actually have to buy one of these power supplies. Your amp will not stop working if you don’t, nor is there a trained team of Naim ‘heavies’ who will re-arrange your kneecaps if you fail to grab a Hi-Cap within an undefined period.

Gosh!! Really? And there was me thinking exactly those thoughts... Which is why I wrote something completely different.

 

[Sloop John B]

I really fail to see why Naim p1sses some people off so much that they feel they have to post on every Naim thread.

Sometimes I’m reminded of the Nobel Prize winner’s lyric

“I hate myself for loving you, and the weakness that it showed”

.sjb

 

[Mullardman]

Maybe it's because people keep asking questions about NAIM, and many people have opinions? NAIM, whether you like it or don't, is a very (some might say deliberately) idiosyncratic brand, and as such is going to generate debate about both its sound, and its business model.

 

[Rack Kit]

So my question is Naim over priced and overrated? What are the alternatives? Do you have to pay such a high price in order to enjoy one of life's simple pleasures, that of listening to music?

So my question is, do we need yet another Naim thread?

 

[Mullardman]

So my answer is.. We have no more NAIM threads than we have BRexit.. or similar.. threads.
It's all part of life's rich tapestry...

 

[ryder]

So my question is Naim over priced and overrated? What are the alternatives? Do you have to pay such a high price in order to enjoy one of life's simple pleasures, that of listening to music?

You don't need to pay high prices for Naim as their entry-level products are still manageable. There are Rega and Exposure as alternatives if you want cheaper or a different sound which may or may not suit everyone's taste. You don't need to pay higher prices to enjoy life's simple pleasures as you have a choice to go for something that's cheaper but still sounds great.

Back to your question whether Naim equipment is overpriced and overrated. To me the low to mid-level gear are not overpriced but the higher range gear and posh Super Lumina wires do appear to be quite costly but that's the price to pay for reference gear. The question of whether Naim is overrated, the way I see it is it's the people who are inclined to make them look overrated.

 

[ryder]

“Piss taking of the highest order”
You called?

This surely looks poor value to me. I believe this is the Flatcap.

This one looks better, much better value. In fact there's too much inside the box and it's looking a little too packed and messy.. the NAC N272. There are reports that this is an excellent piece at a down-to-earth price, and when matched with their reference 555 PSU the performance is elevated to reference level. At the price it looks like a bargain.

 

[James]

I'm currently selling my Naim system, looking around I don't see that other high end hifi brands are that much cheaper.

I thought high-end meant expensive, but expensive doesn't always mean good. But if you want an example of a cheaper but just as good alternative, try Densen. I sold my CDS2/XPS/52/Super/135s six-box kit for equivalent Densen (400XS,250,350s) and got a heap of change. I enjoyed my Densen system without a single upgrade for over ten years, before I rediscovered the Japanese vintage high-end.

 

[Del monaco]

I used to run a Nac82 and Nap180.Built like tanks.They were great at the time, particularly with pop and rock but didn’t really suit classical which has now become my main listening.I also winced at the upgrade path.With some regret, I sold them on and put together a 2nd hand system comprising vintage and new Japanese, Rotel and streaming gear. Never looked back. I have less problems with the sound across all genres now.

 

[flatpopely]

“Piss taking of the highest order”
You called?

Products are priced to make a profit.
People see a few parts and work from there.
I see R and D, case manufacture, assembly, testing, warranty support, dealer support, staff wages, NIC, rent, heating, lighting etc. £50 in parts is £500 for the supported product in the quantity NAIM produce.

 

[Flibbles]

I have a naim system and I am happy with it. I too spend time wondering if I should move to other brands but the one thing that you can't complain about with Naim is the re sale value. It is easy to buy something second hand, hold on to it for a year than then sell it for about the same price. Virtually no other brands have that and means that you can upgrade away knowing it isn't dead money. if I buy other brands they will be worth a whole lot less and I end up paying a lot more when I need to upgrade.
I also think Naim stuff is well made and I like how it sounds so if it ain't broke.... Could I get better else where. Maybe but would my investment be as safe possibly not.

That said there are a few things which annoy me about my Naim system. The biggest one is the hum the power supply's/power amps make. It drives me nuts. If I am in the room with the hifi off it is like a dripping tap. Make it stop! If I turn it off I then have to wait 2 weeks for it to warm up and sound good again.
I also do agree that if you're not careful you end up with a wall of different black boxes with green lights on the front and it is hard to get sign off for that interior design approach (this also results in even more hum!)

 

[Alex N]

If I turn it off I then have to wait 2 weeks for it to warm up and sound good again.

I turn mine on/off every day. Sounds great.

 

[monty]

I loved my 250.2/Supercap2/Nac82 in my old living room in my last house. The same system sounded awful in my new house. I can't state enough, how much the room can positively or adversely impact sound.
I've messed about with tweaks and positioning and found a 'happy', so may revisit Naim. I naively changed from Naim, thinking that was the issue. It clearly wasn't.

 

[DavidS]

Surely kit is to listen to and not an investment ?

 

[SteveH]

I turn mine on/off every day. Sounds great.

Same here; sounds fine.

I have used Naim for nearly 40 years. I have had 12S, 42, 42.5, 62, 32, 32.5, 72, 82, 52 pres; 110, 140, 160 (bolt) and 250 power; SNAPS, HiCap, Supercap; CDi, CDX, CDS; NAIT1; SBLs (awful things); and an ARO & Arageddon for good measure.
All were built like the proverbial brick sh*t house, felt like quality stuff, and were easily serviced if necessary (neither do I subscrube to the doctrine thay they need a recap every 2 weeks).
They sound great as well.
You don't have to keep climbing up the greasy pole as others have said. I settled at 72/hi/250 for years as a "sweet-spot" in the range; a lot of amp for the money that will drive most things.
I did eventually leave them after hearing the Kii3, which forced me to abandon external amps, but I have very, very fond memories of my time with Naim.

 

[Suffolk Tony]

Surely kit is to listen to and not an investment ?

"Yes dear, I know it might seem a bit pricey, but should we fall on hard times I'll be able to sell it for pretty much what I paid for it. So you're happy for me to buy it then? Jolly good! I'll treat you & your lovely mother to a nice cup of tea at Tesco's snack bar".

 

[Mike Reed]

I reckon that electricity usage with keeping my former Naim kit on 24/7 is comparable to having my valved kit fired up twice a week or so. The former was very convenient, however, but the latter is far more involving and musical. Life's full of compromises !

 

[Tony Lockhart]

"Yes dear, I know it might seem a bit pricey, but should we fall on hard times I'll be able to sell it for pretty much what I paid for it. So you're happy for me to buy it then? Jolly good! I'll treat you & your lovely mother to a nice cup of tea at Tesco's snack bar".

I can just imagine the hard, hard stare if you spoke to Mags like that.

In fact, the frosty response might explain the mild flurry we are experiencing