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MDAC First Listen (part 00110111)

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My last point of reference before this week John had made the decision to no longer develop using the original mdac case due to its constrictive size. I think I am now up to speed but correct me if I'm wrong:-

The Mdac2 project with the full size housing and internal PSU is going to be the Fdac, which may have tube/solid stage or both.

Basically correct.

There is a usb isolation module, this is the Detox.

Well its a USB single cleaner and with USB2.0 and Isolated 1.1 output.

It now seems there is an Mdac2 in the works to be completed before the Fdac, to use the board design from the Fdac but in the Mdac case but with a new external psu. I have the option to transfer my pledge to this and then get a 50% discount on the funding for the Fdac.

Now I have a few questions:

Is the Detox needed for the Fdac project or is it to be part of the internals of the dac? If so have i missed out on this or can I still plege my funding?

Detox functions on many levels, the MDAC2 chassis does not lend itself RF screening (obviously not to the same level of Detox's isolated screened sections) - but we have added a USB Hub to the MDAC2 input to at least offer basic Clock domain isolation. On the MDAC2 I have used multiple screened tin "cans" to offer a basic level or screening to help with both RF emissions and reception.

The Detox is only "beneficial" with an external USB audio source - so if you plan to use the DAC connected to say a PC, then the Detox should be considered.


If I stay with Fdac project what is the likely time frame? bearing in mind I'm in no hurry and allowing for John to work his magic.

With in house SMD production then the products will be released in the following order:-

MDAC Streamer PCB (and test DAC)

Detox

MDAC2

VFET's FDAC

What are the final overall costs for both projects? i.e. Mdac 2 pledge + Board + psu, and same for fdac. there was talk of import fees too at one point.

If we manufacture in Europe then there will be no import duty / import fees.

Am I behind in any other funding? I see you require an additional pledge for machinery. Is this for the Fdac too?

Also I have paid my funding pledge for the Mdac2/Fdac L2 £400, but I've never seen my user name on any of the funding lists.

There is no public list, but I'll confirm your funding status tomorrow with Renata.
 
Over the weekend we confirmed the costings on the MDAC2 Streamer PCB with Modified CM3 module - GBP185 (excluding postage).

RPi CM3 based audio optimised streamer:-

3x USB Host ports (+5V PSU current on all ports combined limited to 1.5A total)

HDMI 1080P vidio output

Ethernet Port

USB Slave for firmware upload (Via USB slave port on MDAC2 mainboard / Steamer mini "DAC" board)

Audio subsystem supports DSD256 and PCM 768KHz

Capable of hardware MQA decode (subject to working agreement with MQA) - I will discuss the project with Bob Stuart during Munich.

Jitter free Clock Master mode operate, Bit accurate Audio I/O

We have yet to price the streamers optional budget DAC PCB ONLY (no case) but to the initial sponsors I'd like to see it priced at around GBP80:-

Dual ESS9038Q2M

Single ended RCA and Balanced XLR output

Headphone output

SPDIF Coax input to 384KHz and DSD64

Optical Input to 96KHz

ASync USB supports 768KHz PCM / DSD256

Selectable filters

This is an uncased DAC PCB that will need to be built into a DIY chassis with the Streamer PCB - its electrically safe to be operated exposed (no chance of an electric shock as it used with an external 12 volt PSU), but will be sensitive to potential damage by static discharge.
 
RPi CM3 based audio optimised streamer:-

3x USB Host ports (+5V PSU current on all ports combined limited to 1.5A total)

John, Will there be an Ethernet port? And uUSB Slave for firmware upload?

For the OS, would a standard linux distro boot on the board, allowing kernel/driver patching & compiling 'in-situ'.
 
John, Will there be an Ethernet port? And USB Slave for firmware upload?

Yes - sorry I correct the post above.

The USB slave board is "shared" via a USB Hub with the MDAC2's slave "USB Audio" port.

For the OS, would a standard linux distro boot on the board, allowing kernel/driver patching & compiling 'in-situ'.

Oh - sorry I'm not the one to ask about Linux - I'm just designing the hardware - JiriJ shuld be able to answer if he reads your post.

The must significant difference between the RPi3 and our streamer board (from an RPi software perspective) is that the GPIO pin used for Ethernet Reset has been moved to free up an I2C port, so Linux Config file (what ever its called) will need to be modified to reassign the GPIO used for the LAN Reset pin to the new I/O port pin.

The Streamer PCB also has an on board battery backed-up RTC to make secure network connection easier (no need to enter local time on each power-up).
 
What is this thread all about? Is it now a "givealittle" request and if so, shouldn't it be in the Trade section?

Mr ED
 
Over the weekend we confirmed the costings on the MDAC2 Streamer PCB with Modified CM3 module - GBP185 (excluding postage).

RPi CM3 based audio optimised streamer:-

3x USB Host ports (+5V PSU current on all ports combined limited to 1.5A total)

HDMI 1080P vidio output

Ethernet Port

USB Slave for firmware upload (Via USB slave port on MDAC2 mainboard / Steamer mini "DAC" board)

Audio subsystem supports DSD256 and PCM 768KHz

Capable of hardware MQA decode (subject to working agreement with MQA) - I will discuss the project with Bob Stuart during Munich.

Jitter free Clock Master mode operate, Bit accurate Audio I/O

We have yet to price the streamers optional budget DAC PCB ONLY (no case) but to the initial sponsors I'd like to see it priced at around GBP80:-

Dual ESS9038Q2M

Single ended RCA and Balanced XLR output

Headphone output

SPDIF Coax input to 384KHz and DSD64

Optical Input to 96KHz

ASync USB supports 768KHz PCM / DSD256

Selectable filters

This is an uncased DAC PCB that will need to be built into a DIY chassis with the Streamer PCB - its electrically safe to be operated exposed (no chance of an electric shock as it used with an external 12 volt PSU), but will be sensitive to potential damage by static discharge.
This sound great, I am very interested in the little development DAC. Will also commit to at least one additional streamer.

The streamer option to the MDAC2/FDAC really adds value to the complete package.

The trend is to integrate the streamer into the DAC. I am sure that we will see several of those in Munich, an examples is Aurender A10 (£5.800). And if someone doubt the value of the little DAC take a look at what Bryston pi ($1.295) offers a RPI + DAC hat in a fancy case and it does not support DSD.
 
Over the weekend we confirmed the costings on the MDAC2 Streamer PCB with Modified CM3 module - GBP185 (excluding postage).

RPi CM3 based audio optimised streamer:-

3x USB Host ports (+5V PSU current on all ports combined limited to 1.5A total)

HDMI 1080P vidio output

Ethernet Port

USB Slave for firmware upload (Via USB slave port on MDAC2 mainboard / Steamer mini "DAC" board)

Audio subsystem supports DSD256 and PCM 768KHz

Capable of hardware MQA decode (subject to working agreement with MQA) - I will discuss the project with Bob Stuart during Munich.

Jitter free Clock Master mode operate, Bit accurate Audio I/O

We have yet to price the streamers optional budget DAC PCB ONLY (no case) but to the initial sponsors I'd like to see it priced at around GBP80:-

Dual ESS9038Q2M

Single ended RCA and Balanced XLR output

Headphone output

SPDIF Coax input to 384KHz and DSD64

Optical Input to 96KHz

ASync USB supports 768KHz PCM / DSD256

Selectable filters

This is an uncased DAC PCB that will need to be built into a DIY chassis with the Streamer PCB - its electrically safe to be operated exposed (no chance of an electric shock as it used with an external 12 volt PSU), but will be sensitive to potential damage by static discharge.

I'm in for 1x Streamer PCB with Modified CM3 module and 1X DAC PCB, please John.
 
Me too John, but there is no need to ship as I wouldn't know what to do with them...would you please just keep them aside in your lab and send them together with the MDAC2 when its ready.
 
So still not sure what a streamer adds but it looks like I could load Kodi on and stream via Ethernet port to watch video off Utube etc I assume the board can be transferred to FDAC.
 
No one saying that so far. If that streamer card is the same for the TDAC I would be interestet to know.
That would perhaps change my mind

It would simply not make sense if the streamer board was different for any of the DAC's: DEVDAC, MDAC2, FDAC, TDAC etc.

So it is pretty safe to assume it will be the same.
 
Is the little DAC PCB stand-alone (without the streamer)? If so, what input would it have?

Ok, saw SPDIF coaxial / optical. Don't mind me...
 
Is the little DAC PCB stand-alone (without the streamer)? If so, what input would it have?

Ok, saw SPDIF coaxial / optical. Don't mind me...

Sadly no, the "Little DAC PCB" is designed to complement the Streamer PCB to allow development, and while we are at it we can also support external USB and SPDIF sources, so we added these features.

The Little DAC requires the "processing power" of the streamers audio subsystem - its not designed as a stand alone device. The intention of this DAC board is to allow software development of the streamer board ahead of the MDAC2 "Audio section" being released. The Streamer PCB requires the "DAC PCB" as the DAC PCB provides the system clocks (The streamer is clocked by the Audio Master Clock), PSU DC input and USB Slave port etc.

The DAC PCB will also have an interface expansion connector for an ADC board so we can also develop the analogue input path (from the software perspective).
 
It would simply not make sense if the streamer board was different for any of the DAC's: DEVDAC, MDAC2, FDAC, TDAC etc.

So it is pretty safe to assume it will be the same.

Rune,

The MDAC2 streamer PCB is physically formatted to fit within the MDAC2 chassis - its not ideal (RF screening etc). The MDAC2 and FDAC also feature a different connector arrangement etc.

FDAC (TDAC) is a no compromise design, so while the schematic of the MDAC2 / FDAC streamer will be similar (the same from a software perspective) we will design a custom FDAC PCB.

The advantage of in house SMD is that as long as we don't have to reload the reels on the SMD machine, its simply a matter of loading a new program and you can produce different boards with ease.

The MDAC2 / FDAC streamer design will use the same components, only a physically different PCB.
 
Me too John, but there is no need to ship as I wouldn't know what to do with them...would you please just keep them aside in your lab and send them together with the MDAC2 when its ready.

Tim,

In that case, you would only need to order the streamer PCB and not also the "Temporary" DAC :)
 
So still not sure what a streamer adds but it looks like I could load Kodi on and stream via Ethernet port to watch video off Utube etc.

Yes, I'll be using for this purpose - freeing up my PC CPU :)

You can also replay directly from a USB flash drive or even an externally powered HDD so no need for a PC for Audio / Video replay.

I assume the board can be transferred to FDAC.

Well the CM3 module itself can be by simple unplugging it like a RAM stick, but the PCB's will be physically different.

Better if you returned your MDAC2 streamer PCB then we could swap it for an FDAC Streamer board for a small cost difference.
 
Rune,

The MDAC2 streamer PCB is physically formatted to fit within the MDAC2 chassis - its not ideal (RF screening etc). The MDAC2 and FDAC also feature a different connector arrangement etc.

FDAC (TDAC) is a no compromise design, so while the schematic of the MDAC2 / FDAC streamer will be similar (the same from a software perspective) we will design a custom FDAC PCB.

The advantage of in house SMD is that as long as we don't have to reload the reels on the SMD machine, its simply a matter of loading a new program and you can produce different boards with ease.

The MDAC2 / FDAC streamer design will use the same components, only a physically different PCB.
OK my guess was wrong it is only the modified CM3 that can be reused.

But some don't want MDAC2 and will wait for FDAC, can they order a streamer board now for delivery together with FDAC?
Else it will mean that less will sign up for the streamer.
 
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