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Decca cartridges

off she goes!
the anticipation begins!!

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just a thought,has anyone gone from a line contact to paratrace stylus?
big difference? i was told the paratrace is a lot smoother in the top end.
 
Paratrace is a form of line contact so it would be good to see the geometry specs for the tip. The most important one for audio quality and high frequency performance is the minor radius of the scanning surface IME. Tip geometry has no impact in low frequency of mid frequency performance since these are essentially determined by the quality of the generator and the compliance/VTF/damping used. So the tip type is all about the HF performance and wear....

Some line contact tips really aren't worth the bother if the minor radius is large, say >5um. Other than possibly slightly reduced wear (on tip and groove) the performance will be no better than the finer elliptical tips (usually 5x8um). Essentially you have 4 categories which I'd describe as follows:

- Conical. Will always have impaired HF performance and high inner groove distortion. The H response will also droop by several dB as the stylus moves across the disc, sounding duller on inner tracks. This is called scanning loss.

- Standard elliptical. Typically has 8um minor radius. Better than conical, less scanning loss, marginally reduced IGD.

- Special/Hyper elliptical. Typically 5um minor radius and greatly improved HF performance, with little response variation across the disc. Still some IGD on 'hotter' inner tracks and sibilant vocals can still be a problem.

- Standard line contact. Typically 8x30-75um. Potentially lower record wear thanks to the larger major radius which gives less focused VTF on one spot. Audio performance no better than standard elliptical. Not worth the bother IME as they always carry a cost premium.

- Fine line. Typically 2-5um x 30-120um. This group offer the best HF performance, and those with the smallest minor radius (<4um) show no perceptible response shift across the disc. Sibilance should be clean on all but the hottest cuts and IGD rarely noticeable.
 
the report back with current prices,
not bad for 50 yr old stylus that imo betters a 2m black or zyx r-100

1. Decca C4E cartridge, serial no.11305.
Stylus 20% worn output and separation good.

Options:-
Clean and test..............................£40.00
Install extended contact stylus..£255.00
Install Paratrace stylus..............£300.00
 
it is back!
setting it up properly today seemed very easy,almost too easy,i left the tonearm height where it was and that seems to be right for the retip. tracking force is on 2 grams ,im not getting to anal just yet until ive put some hrs on the tip.

whats it sound like? bloody marvelous,it already showed a clean pair of heels to my 2m black and also a borrowed zyx-r100 with just a elliptical stylus,the extended fine line stylus has done exactly what i hoped for.
that is to bring the treble up in line with the bass and mid range.

this is without doubt the best cartridge i have heard to date,life like sounds,cymbals sound incredibly real,no tizz ,just real metallic sounds. the bass drum sounds like its being stamped on using my trusty copy of 'the wall' album as a reference,the soundstage is big and powerful
acoustic instruments are a joy to listen to,plucked upright bass notes and finger slides are very good,i hate to use the 'in the room' phrase so i wont lol.

i have to keep reminding myself that this is a 50yr old cartridge,how the hell does it sound so good? whats it going to be like when its bedded in? i simply just want to keep playing records,it is making me do it!!


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I think this is where hi-fi went all wrong in the 70s and 80s; it became too much about tonal balance and soundstage, and dynamics suffered as a result. If you listen to a old acoustic gramophone, you get a dynamic, direct sound, and the music sounds 'real' as a result, even if if it's not that accurate.

What Decca cartridges and Tannoy speakers and the like seem to do, is to remind us just how important dynamics are.
 
I think this is where hi-fi went all wrong in the 70s and 80s; it became too much about tonal balance and soundstage, and dynamics suffered as a result. If you listen to a old acoustic gramophone, you get a dynamic, direct sound, and the music sounds 'real' as a result, even if if it's not that accurate.

What Decca cartridges and Tannoy speakers and the like seem to do, is to remind us just how important dynamics are.

Agreed. Dynamics are the most important requirement for a realistic sound.
 
Several I'd say. Frequency response, phase coherence, noise, dynamic range at least.

On the other hand you could just listen to a drum kit and see how realistic it sounds.
 
And what physical property of the audio signal do dynamics correspond to?

Easy to tell from a waveform where the peaks are, how many db above the median etc. Far less easy to measure loss of same in a domestic setting as none of the simplistic measurements used by audiophiles or released by manufacturers cover it, yet even a cursory listen to a huge pair of Altec, Tannoy, JBL or similar monitors indicate how most speakers struggle to convey that utter ease and freedom one hears with live acoustic music due to lack of headroom, air-moving capabilities etc.
 
Easy to tell from a waveform where the peaks are, how many db above the median etc. Far less easy to measure loss of same in a domestic setting as none of the simplistic measurements used by audiophiles or released by manufacturers cover it, yet even a cursory listen to a huge pair of Altec, Tannoy, JBL or similar monitors indicate how most speakers struggle to convey that utter ease and freedom one hears with live acoustic music due to lack of headroom, air-moving capabilities etc.

Indeed, no problem measuring the dynamics of the actual signal. Lots of standards for that. But somehow there has to be a measurable change to the signal between the source and our ears where the reduction in dynamics happens. One source of loss is of course compression of peaks due to saturation/clipping in the amp or speakers, but if that was all there is, we would all have 2 kW amplifiers :)
 
The big Ureis - 813 and 815s had the reputation among studios of being able to reproduce a drum kit realistically and at identical volume to the real thing. They are 100db plus efficient and would be driven by large and capable amps, eg Urei 6500 275 wpc, or a pair bridged to give 900w.
 
Indeed, no problem measuring the dynamics of the actual signal. Lots of standards for that. But somehow there has to be a measurable change to the signal between the source and our ears where the reduction in dynamics happens. One source of loss is of course compression of peaks due to saturation/clipping in the amp or speakers, but if that was all there is, we would all have 2 kW amplifiers :)

The amp power is only relevant when viewed with the speaker efficiency, e.g. the little 2.3 Watt SET I use in my TV rig will have way more headroom than most domestic hi-fi systems as it is driving 105db efficient Klipsch La Scalas. Allowing for two speakers in the room (+3db), but not factoring wall/corner gain as that is probably in the Klipsch figure, that equates to 111db headroom before I even get to the .3 Watt! Equivalent to about half a kilowatt into a typical hi-fi box speaker, which will likely be suffering awful distortion if asked to deal with a fraction of that power.

Do you have any suggestions for a recording of a drum kit that could sound realistic given a replay system capable of suitable dynamics?

The old audiophile staples were the Sheffield Lab Drum Record and the Charlie Byrd Crystal Clear direct cut. I have the latter and it is very good indeed. I’m sure someone must have done a good high-res digital stunt recording by now though.
 
The old audiophile staples were the Sheffield Lab Drum Record and the Charlie Byrd Crystal Clear direct cut. I have the latter and it is very good indeed. I’m sure someone must have done a good high-res digital stunt recording by now though.

I have a copy of the Sheffield Lab Drum Record which is a test LP. It is beautifully recorded on the Dynamic Experience Volume 1 CD (track 6).
 


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