That's a keen observation Mr raga, the thing is criticise Islam and suddenly you're 'Islamophobic'! Does that make some of us 'Christianphobes too then?I think this goes to show how little religion plays a part in British society, Muslim is the second largest religion in the UK with just 4% of the whole population, I think this goes some way to explaining the problem.
Non religious people in the UK have problems with any religion,
recently here on pfm the Jehovah's witness religion came in for the usual battering without an eyelid being blinked, you have to ask, if this had been aimed at the Muslim religion, how the thread would have panned out, I imagine, considering the amount of venom spouted, it would have closed down sharpish but as it was this particular religion it was fine to carry on regardless,
we either respect all religions for what they are & what they represent to the individual & give due care to how we portray them or we ban all religious posts as it seems quite biased as far as I can see. Either we agree any religion is fare game or none is.
I would like someone who battered the religion a few short days ago (there were plenty, including mods) to state how they feel this is ok yet feel it not ok to spout discontent for the Muslim or any other religion.
Why should one set of personal beliefs take preference over another.
I personally have no religious beliefs, I have in my time mocked religious beliefs, including the DUP quite recently, but having time to reflect, it is their right to believe what they wish as is any religion.
The Jehovah posts show how hate can fester & spread quite rapidly in online forums, some say it in jest, some don't, it matters not.
Since when has a hate crime become a terror attack? The results are equally appalling but am I the only one who finds this revision of terrorism problematic?
Sort of my point MikeThat's a keen observation Mr raga, the thing is criticise Islam and suddenly you're 'Islamophobic'! Does that make some of us 'Christianphobes too then?
Does that make some of us 'Christianphobes too then?
When it involves trying to kill and injure people in numbers. The fact that he only killed one person is irrelevant, he went in to do as much damage as he could. How is that any different from the Westminster or London Bridge attacks?
Douglas Murray is an apologist and advocate for Neocon-led Western intervention/terrorism in the Middle East and rabid Islamophobe.
You're as likely to be radicalised reading his 'work' as you are reading something written by Abu Hamza.
Of course the BBC has him on every other day, but then that organisation is fast becoming the media wing of Neoconservative terror.
Sort of my point Mike
I do feel that if someone disagrees with Islam they will be seen as racist, which is obviously ludicrous & why other, "non respected" religions are easier to put down.
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That's a Theresa May answer, as in completely ignoring what I've said and adding your own little bit of spin at the end.Don't be silly, I don't know everything about Murray, but he is an intelligent commentator, unlike Mr hook handed ogre.
Care to know why Katie Hopkins was sacked at LBC?
She made an alleged 'anti-semetic' remark yet everyone know's she's well known for anti-islamic/islamphonic views and tweets.
I would like someone who battered the religion a few short days ago (there were plenty, including mods) to state how they feel this is ok yet feel it not ok to spout discontent for the Muslim or any other religion.
Why should one set of personal beliefs take preference over another.
I personally have no religious beliefs, I have in my time mocked religious beliefs, including the DUP quite recently, but having time to reflect, it is their right to believe what they wish as is any religion.
The Jehovah posts show how hate can fester & spread quite rapidly in online forums, some say it in jest, some don't, it matters not.
First, please don't take this personally. I just quoted you as an example of what many people seem to be saying. Second, I never said nor implied that the number of casualties made a difference.
There are fairly clear definitions of what constitutes terrorism, not to mention a whole body of academic literature, that usually revolves around a political cause. This guy was at best a misguided idiot and at worst probably a xenophobic, racist killer. But just because he used a van to carry this out does not make him a terrorist. I could be wrong and we could find out he has an arsenal of weapons and a systematic plan to terrorise the Muslim community. But somehow I doubt he's that clever.
PS To put it another way if anyone here can "see that the EDL/BNP/Britain First/NF have a point" they can f*** right off. pfm really is not for them. I will waste neither my time or money promoting these views. Please believe me on this, I have a site with many, many thousands of members, I'll happily ditch hundreds to get this ideology right off here (I'd actually only have to ditch maybe three, non of which are even customers!). This is an anti-fascist/anti-racist site!
My fiancee is Muslim - when I see the faces of many life long friends when I explain that to them it makes me realise just what an issue much of middle class Britain has and how much effort it will take to enlighten them.
Don't be silly, I don't know everything about Murray, but he is an intelligent commentator, unlike Mr hook handed ogre.
Ok, I'll engage with this. First off I'm an atheist. I don't believe in any gods, ghosts, afterlife or any other such thing. I am 100% a spiritual/mystical free-zone. I do however live in an area with a very high Muslim population and I recognise exactly the scapegoating and demonisation they face as I've seen it first hand. As such I keep that bullshit right off this, my site, my place of work. I am also aware that pfm has a very high Asian/Muslim userbase and I seek to cause no offence to these people, my friends.
The JW thing struck me very much as lightweight lighthearted fun. Just ways of gently taking the mick a bit if they continue to knock at your door uninvited. A whole different thing to Muslims who as part of their day to day life get spat on, have bottles and stones lobbed at them, have train-loads of unemployable knuckle-dragging EDL shit turning up to trash their business etc and are pretty much treated the way the Jewish population of Germany was way back in the early '30s when fascism was taking a foothold.
PS To put it another way if anyone here can "see that the EDL/BNP/Britain First/NF have a point" they can f*** right off. pfm really is not for them. I will waste neither my time or money promoting these views. Please believe me on this, I have a site with many, many thousands of members, I'll happily ditch hundreds to get this ideology right off here (I'd actually only have to ditch maybe three, non of which are even customers!). This is an anti-fascist/anti-racist site!
I agree with much of what you have typed there Tony but I think it would be wrong to ban the likes of mikeandvan and the small minority like him for holding the views which they do. To my mind, it is much better to debate with them and try and win them round with reasoned argument. Thankfully, it is not as though this site is overrun with this type of poster. What you don't want is a site completely made up of those who all share the same political outlook and viewpoint. You just end up with a dull echo chamber.
I'm curious to know if you will be converting in order to get married?