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AVI's new floorstanders and subs or three way in two boxes (part II)

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Sorry, couldn't resist that jc; but really, you're really not doing AVI much good in terms of marketing here. However, since AVI is doing extremely well as you say, why not leave it for a while?

Oh I don't know. One of the smallest companies being frequently the most talked about. No doubt a few people will investigate the products to find out what all the fuss is about.
I know I did with the ADM9, and found it to be rather good.
 
Un-informed bollox, Dave.

JC

No it's not. I'm just taking Ash's comments on the differences into account, coupled with measured and documented facts on the ADM9.1's. In the total absense of any other evidence to the contrary, I feel it's a very fair supposition, is it not?
 
Not at all, Steven, - you're construction is putting words into my mouth, which are of your choosing, seemingly for you're own contentious purpose.

The specs are available if you know where to look.

JC

And very ironic as this is a tactic much used by Steven when asked for any form of justification for his odd beliefs.
.

''That's a poor use of deflection to justify not putting information in the public domain''
 
Well, at least we're agreed on that. :D






HaHa, - 'fade away' - like your forum has ! eh, Steven, ? you seem to be the only remaining poster these days.

Your HiFi views, and post on various forums, are well known to be extremely weird ;)

JC

Ad hominem and off-topic comments reported. You never learn, do you?
 
Not really, I'm just a member of the forum that you and Ash have chosen to promote AVI's products on, this isn't an AVI brochure.

Without wanting to help you do your job better (because I don't like sneakiness) you need to look at your own modus operandi. You simply get the reaction you have earned.

Actually Greg this post was begun by me because I'm most genuinely interested in AVI stuff because all that I have ACTUALLY OWNED has sounded quite excellent and the vfm is very good indeed.

The fact that JC is a bit uppitty along with a good few net warriors here does not for a moment detract from the sound of the equipment.

As this is a hifi/music forum you'd think that might appear readily and glowingly apparent.
 
And very ironic as this is a tactic much used by Steven when asked for any form of justification for his odd beliefs.
.

''That's a poor use of deflection to justify not putting information in the public domain''

The best form of defence is attack I guess. It's the AVI way.

Repeatedly asked rhetorical questions require no answer.

All genuine questions are answered.
 
This thread has become a nasty one and for people like myself who may be interested in these 40's I feel less inclined to say anything, until now, as it seems to be all venom. How very sad. It's like a play ground here with childish behaviour. I expect to be flamed now of course. The sad thing is the comments are so vehement towards AVi as if they are only company who make claims/specs, bigging up their product etc. Christ you only have to look around at all the products that get mentioned on this site to see the whole industry is like it. Christ the whole blinking marketing world is like it. It's only hi fi guys!!

Indeed Mr Ohm. With the likes of Ivor and his lp12, Naim and their unicorn skin clad power cables, and dozens of other shysters you'd think one more wouldn't make difference eh?

Besides, don't you think the more vocal detractors a little amusing? On the sorry arsed side of course, but funny too.
 
More deflection. OK, AVI's woes are entirely self-inflicted....

Better now?

Steven, so far as I know AVI don't have any woes.

They are a successful company, selling very well.

If you're referring to some slagging on pfm I doubt very much it bothers the company at all.

Seems to twist JC's panties a bit though.
 
I've never heard a pair of AVI speakers.

Just looking at the measurements by AndyG there is quite some discrepancy between the quoted figures and the measured figures wrt the amplifier's powers. Clearly AVI's are more willy waving...

Can't AVI just come clean on the real world performance? I would expect it would be too much of a disappointment for current owners, and think of all those glossys that would have to be reprinted ;)

What do other manufacturers quote? Speaker resistance multiplied by the amps rail voltages?

The other good post from AndyG on the AVI forum is this...

Ashley James wrote:
Shenzi has explained, but I'd add that you've measured relatively low average power into speakers at normal levels and what I subsequently explained was that at these normal levels, there are lots of peaks of hundreds of Watts that the amp needs to be able to reproduce. If you turn the volume up, these will clip obviously long before anything like the full 250 Watts are approached. The mean average consumption will still be low and very little heat will be generated by the amp.

Ash
Gotcha - but this isn't nearly what you think it is. You can see it clearly in the waveforms.

Look, every amplifier has a pre-amp that attenuates the signal to the main power amp.
If you have very peaky program material then you can adjust your gain until you see the peaks are just below clipping at, say, 250W peak. Whatever these peaks are. Drums. Horns. Hammers. Whatever. You can use a scope and adjust the gain easily to make full use of the amplifier.

Now you will notice that the pre-amp gain is up VERY high. VERY VERY high. If you have really quiet passages and you have a good and quiet amp then yes, the quiet passages will be quiet and the peaks will be 250W. And the pre-amp gain will be very high.

However, if now play something else like Me, Myself I and you turn down the pre-amp gain to a comfortable level then you are NOT going to see any 250W peaks. In fact the peaks will be attenuated by the same amount as the pre-amp gain is attenuated. This is busy music that has a relatively low peak to average content - compared to an orchestra that is.

This concept of listening at a low level (pre-amp gain down) to something like Me Myself I and somehow the amp needs to produce large peaks is completely beyond me. The orchestra's are the greatest example of dynamic range and it's why you need to listen to an orchestra at very high pre-amp gain! Your preamp setting effectively regulates the peak power the amp will EVER produce under any circumstance.

This is the best way to describe it:

If I've got my gain down on my AMP to, say, below a still loud 60 (it goes 0-75 - I normally listen at 45 or 50) I CAN NOT create ANY waveform on the digital input that will EVER result in a 200W peak. The gain needs to be way up to generate large peak powers.
I can also show you this on my ADM9. Give me a track to play. Give me a reference gain setting that's 1/3 max volume or something (say a certain voltage amplitude on the woofer at 1kHz driven by a full-16bit range .WAV sinusoid). I can show you exactly the instantaneous power waveform. Unless I have the pre-amp volume WAY up I am never going to come close to seeing 250W peaks or even 125W peaks. It just doesn't work this way. Unless I have a huge amplitude input signal and with digital sources this is TOTALLY limited. Like I said, it's all in the original waveform. All these fast peaks where you need 10s or 100s of watts to support when listening at low levels simply don't exist in the original content!!! It's right there (or not there) in the .wav file info.

I really don't know where this thinking comes from.....

Anyway, I need to understand it do move forward with the analysis of my design.
 
Steven, so far as I know AVI don't have any woes.

They are a successful company, selling very well.

If you're referring to some slagging on pfm I doubt very much it bothers the company at all.

Seems to twist JC's panties a bit though.

The company is fine as are its products. They do what it says on the tin.

The internet marketing could be best described as counter-productive though, especially with JC as their ambassador.

The terms "loose cannon" and "liability" spring to mind.

Btw, if you succeed in getting a pair (or two halves of two pairs) to work with your MDAC I would be interested to hear such a setup.
 
If the '40s were properly designed they wouldn't need a sub. I thought you guys were into reducing the box count.

The sub is an extra sale I s'pose. I can't knock you guys for trying.

It is no different to Naim creating a need for off-board power supplies.

And if electricity was super it wouldn't need perspex Steven.

(I apologise to others for repeatedly mentioning this, but I have to say it is fabulous.)
 
Sorry Arsed side of course, but funny too.

arthur said:
the timber ones are arse ugly.

arthur said:
But the big 100' and 150's, pure arse.

arthur said:
Fart tube ? :):) He has an arse attached to a speaker.

arthur said:
I have gone through this twice, it's disgusting and a pain in the arse.

arthur said:
An arse on gay penalty takers!

[it goes on for quite a few pages]

You have an anal fixation
I approve

Butthurt.jpg
 
The company is fine as are its products. They do what it says on the tin.

The internet marketing could be best described as counter-productive though, especially with JC as their ambassador.

The terms "loose cannon" and "liability" spring to mind.

Btw, if you succeed in getting a pair (or two halves of two pairs) to work with your MDAC I would be interested to hear such a setup

You missed this one Arthur.
 
The company is fine as are its products. They do what it says on the tin.

The internet marketing could be best described as counter-productive though, especially with JC as their ambassador.

The terms "loose cannon" and "liability" spring to mind.

Btw, if you succeed in getting a pair (or two halves of two pairs) to work with your MDAC I would be interested to hear such a setup.

You'd be quite welcome Steven. I live in Newcastle.
 
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