What's all the aggression about in the audio room?

[BlueEyes]

Raj, weird that the CDP was on the website and now isn't?

I am aware that ATC are also developing a DAC/Pre.

Concerning the new tweeter, did ATC give a decision for the delay, my understanding is the reason I gave and you should know better than to say "very soon" with ATC

As you know, the new tweeter in the 50/100 actives has been promised, literally, for years.

I'll await with interest the new 50/100 actives with the new tweeter at which time I will then make a decision or maybe I might.

Anyway, as I am very poor but such a nice bloke all you rich audiophools should have a whip-round to buy me a new pair if only to shut me up going on about them?

 

[darrylfunk]

I know some exceptionally highly regarded tonmeisters and engineers who would choke on the arrogance of such a statement. Which is why I think it's better to walk away than to pander to the ego of a jumped-up console jockey with monumental delusions of grandeur.

I think this place could benefit from an 'ignore' button.

an odd thing to say.....alan sircom declares war on joe meek, brian eno, dr dre, adrian sherwood, alex paterson, alan parsons, george martin, james guthrie, alex sadkin, motown's mix engineers and producers, john leckie, steve nye etc etc etc......bloody console jockeys.....

liked your swipe at the hi fi 'jehovah's witness types' very good, people going round trying to flog their magazine - the watchtower....

wait a minute you go around flooging your own magazine hi fi plus tower.....does that make you the religous nutter???

 

[Fox]

reminds me of the old adage "If you can't do something properly, then teach it , if you can't even do that, then become a journalist"

 

[Joe P]

S-Man,

Am I fooling myself that they are capable of producing real bass?

Nah, I was just in parody mode to illustrate a point.

Joe

 

[wirbeltier]

To answer Spacey's question directly there are three distinct parties at play and in conflict here. I'll try my best to identify them without being judgemental:

Group A:

Technically sophisticated long time audiophiles who know foo when the hear it. Some of these individuals are Alpha males type personalities and won't let any foo go unchallenged.

Group B:

Audiophiles who are trying to make a living from their favourite hobby. Tough spot to be in when the hobby as we know it is rapidly changing. Smart guys who have the technical attributes of Group A but by necessity some have had to develop what some may call unsavoury marketing skills.

Group C:

Beta males. Members of neither of the above groups. Usually hanging around the periphery of the action making completely nonsensical statements while never really comprehending what's going on. Usually buy all kinds of foo.


Your Pal

Louballoo

The problem with those in Group A is their over-developed feeling of self-worth, and that they challenge everything that falls not into their view of the world. Foo is what they decide it to be. If they cant measure it, it can not exist. Traces of sociopathy there.

 

[Paul R]

It is IMO arrogant for a recording engineer to consider both the artist and the music as merely a 'canvas' for their art. A good engineer should be a broker for the artists they are recording; their art - and I don't deny it's an art - is to bring out the best in that artist and the piece of music.

I take your point, but I didn't read Teddy's analogy as arrogance. If we consider the way George Martin worked with some of the Beatles songs, does that not fit both the 'canvas' and 'best in that artist' clauses?

Paul

 

[Fox]

And

Member D: Here to post ponies because that is all that makes sense anymore

 

[bob atherton]

I take your point, but I didn't read Teddy's analogy as arrogance. If we consider the way George Martin worked with some of the Beatles songs, does that not fit both the 'canvas' and 'best in that artist' clauses?

Paul

+1

IMHO the producer should be part of the music making team.

 

[Plutox]

ATC are an astonishing company and, as you know, don't change their products for the sake of it and don't update existing products without being sure

It is interesting what can happen when reputable professional companies dip their toes into the domestic marketplace and, possibly, find a niche.

Take dCS for example - 10 years ago they were the toast of the pro. conversion town: they have now pulled out of the pro. market entirely. This gives rise to an interesting question. Do you earn more selling pro. units at, say, £5k each or selling ...how many??? domestic units at £20k++

A fascinating exercise in market economics.

 

[Arkless Electronics]

TA DA!

This seems to me like the way forward for audio in the 21st century!
Only thing is.... is the beer made purely to the reinheitsgebot standard? Is the yeast authentic? Are the hops organically grown?
Ahrg!!!! here we go again!!
I'll get my coat

 

[darrylfunk]

This seems to me like the way forward for audio in the 21st century!
Only thing is.... is the beer made purely to the reinheitsgebot standard? Is the yeast authentic? Are the hops organically grown?
Ahrg!!!! here we go again!!
I'll get my coat

i think the feedback and vibration may ruin the condition of the beer.....active beer cooling should be done in separate conditioning areas acoustically isolated.

 

[Paul R]

It does seem strange IMO that these 2 products still await such development with years passing by, especially, when the present tweeter is considered a relative weakness in the context of the speaker as a whole.

It's possible that the present tweeter isn't that weak and is quite hard to better. It's a relatively expensive SEAS I think. Presumably the 200/300 need a bigger tweeter because they need to go louder and have a beefier treble amp and this was easier to engineer in house.

Or not.

Paul

 

[Arkless Electronics]

i think the feedback and vibration may ruin the condition of the beer.....active beer cooling should be done in separate conditioning areas acoustically isolated.

Indeed. In fact I find that by having a special platform in my fridge, constructed of oxygen free copper and balanced on shakti stones, the beer tastes so much better in ways I can only imagine.

 

[Joe P]

Space is da Place,

TA DA!

Why is the pfm type wearing Gene Simmons God of Thunder boots?

Joe

 

[Ashley James]

It isn't the tweeter at all, it's the bass mid crossover that causes the harshness and lack of clarity as I have explained earlier. The phase integrity at the lower crossover is way out because the dome rolls out steeply at the crossover point. It doesn't matter so much difference at the top, so I don't think a tweeter would make much difference.

This is a problem with all three ways, B & W avoid it by using a much wider bandwidth 6" mid driver.

Ash

 

[Joe Hutch]

Group C:

Beta males. Members of neither of the above groups. Usually hanging around the periphery of the action making completely nonsensical statements while never really comprehending what's going on.

But unlikely to die of a heart attack brought on by reading opinions with which they disagree, or to piss people off by droning on and on and on and on and on.

 

[PsB]

To answer Spacey's question directly there are three distinct parties at play and in conflict here. I'll try my best to identify them without being judgemental:

Group A:

Technically sophisticated long time audiophiles who know foo when the hear it. Some of these individuals are Alpha males type personalities and won't let any foo go unchallenged.

Group B:

Audiophiles who are trying to make a living from their favourite hobby. Tough spot to be in when the hobby as we know it is rapidly changing. Smart guys who have the technical attributes of Group A but by necessity some have had to develop what some may call unsavoury marketing skills.

Group C:

Beta males. Members of neither of the above groups. Usually hanging around the periphery of the action making completely nonsensical statements while never really comprehending what's going on. Usually buy all kinds of foo.


Your Pal

Louballoo

The world according to Louballoo. Buy now while stocks last.

 

[sideshowbob]

Group D:

People who have attained the realisation that audiophilia is a neurosis and all hi-fi sounds basically absolutely fine and isn't worth arguing about at all.

 

[BlueEyes]

It isn't the tweeter at all, it's the bass mid crossover that causes the harshness and lack of clarity as I have explained earlier. The phase integrity at the lower crossover is way out because the dome rolls out steeply at the crossover point. It doesn't matter so much difference at the top, so I don't think a tweeter would make much difference.

This is a problem with all three ways, B & W avoid it by using a much wider bandwidth 6" mid driver.

Ash

Ash, are you talking about the ATC 50/100 actives?

 

[MVV]

Group D:

People who have attained the realisation that audiophilia is a neurosis and all hi-fi sounds basically absolutely fine and isn't worth arguing about at all.

There is a lot of truth in this. I've got a very expensive system that sounds very good. (WTA GTA/32.5 Hicap/mono 110s/ Neat Ultimatums) However I recently put together a 70s Sony DD/Creek/Kef system for £200 in another room. I really enjoy it partly because 'it' doesn't cross my mind when I put a record on. It's all about the music, nothing else. I find myself playing it rather than the posh one.